Peace on Earth.
Good will toward men.
Merry Christmas

Same to ya

"franktee" wrote:

>
> Peace on Earth.
> Good will toward men.
> Merry Christmas
>

same to you franktee.
merry christmas....

"franktee" wrote:

>
> Peace on Earth.
> Good will toward men.
> Merry Christmas
>

Mele Kalikimaka

bobc

"franktee" <franktee@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:74650E5D-036B-4AB5-9CD3-67CD1D27CA92@microsoft.com...
>
> Peace on Earth.
> Good will toward men.
> Merry Christmas
>

You've got that scripture wrong franktee! It has been punctuated
incorrectly, thus people typically MISunderstand it! And CHRISTMAS is
not (read NOT) the time of Christ's birth, it the time of making money
for greedy merchants!

Remember Mat 10:34 & Luke 12:51
___
"franktee" <franktee@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:74650E5D-036B-4AB5-9CD3-67CD1D27CA92@microsoft.com...
>
> Peace on Earth.
> Good will toward men.
> Merry Christmas
>

Take your cynical attidtude elsewhere, can you prove the date of Christs
birth? NO!
so what is one day over another we could have chosen May 19th.
Todays Mature Christian say it's not the date it's the intent.
So what if Christmas has pagen foundations, ie the tree, if the intent is to
celebrate the Birth of Christ it works.

Yes companies make money off Christmas, it's the world, so I say don't be
cynical, get saved and be a mature Christian, be happy, the kingdom is at
hand.

Continue to Celebrate the Birth of Christ and be giving in spirit.

"none" wrote:

> You've got that scripture wrong franktee! It has been punctuated
> incorrectly, thus people typically MISunderstand it! And CHRISTMAS is
> not (read NOT) the time of Christ's birth, it the time of making money
> for greedy merchants!
>
> Remember Mat 10:34 & Luke 12:51
> ___
> "franktee" <franktee@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:74650E5D-036B-4AB5-9CD3-67CD1D27CA92@microsoft.com...
> >
> > Peace on Earth.
> > Good will toward men.
> > Merry Christmas
> >
>
>
>

HUM-BUG

"none" wrote:

> You've got that scripture wrong franktee! It has been punctuated
> incorrectly, thus people typically MISunderstand it! And CHRISTMAS is
> not (read NOT) the time of Christ's birth, it the time of making money
> for greedy merchants!
>
> Remember Mat 10:34 & Luke 12:51
> ___
> "franktee" <franktee@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:74650E5D-036B-4AB5-9CD3-67CD1D27CA92@microsoft.com...
> >
> > Peace on Earth.
> > Good will toward men.
> > Merry Christmas
> >
>
>
>

On Mon, 24 Dec 2007 14:47:01 -0800, sgopus
<sgopus@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>Take your cynical attidtude elsewhere, can you prove the date of Christs
>birth? NO!
>so what is one day over another we could have chosen May 19th.
>Todays Mature Christian say it's not the date it's the intent.
>So what if Christmas has pagen foundations, ie the tree, if the intent is to
>celebrate the Birth of Christ it works.
>
>Yes companies make money off Christmas, it's the world, so I say don't be
>cynical, get saved and be a mature Christian, be happy, the kingdom is at
>hand.
>
>Continue to Celebrate the Birth of Christ and be giving in spirit.

Perhaps you could be giving in spirit yourself, friend.

Also realize that Christmas ("Christ's Day", a very early Christian
celebration) does NOT have "pagen (sic) foundations", as you claim,
and as is popularly believed. In fact, His birth has been celebrated
by the Church since her very beginning, although the central
celebration of the Church has always been the Eucharistic Meal, of
course.

Nevertheless, I understand your desire to put His Death in the
forefront. It comes pretty "naturally" to one who is a lover of
Christ.

By the way, a "mature Christian" would not even be involving himself
in this controversy.

What do the Apostles teach us? "Love covers a multitude of sins".

>
>"none" wrote:
>
>> You've got that scripture wrong franktee! It has been punctuated
>> incorrectly, thus people typically MISunderstand it! And CHRISTMAS is
>> not (read NOT) the time of Christ's birth, it the time of making money
>> for greedy merchants!
>>
>> Remember Mat 10:34 & Luke 12:51

Don't be so dogmatic so young, friend. The fact is, there is no
"punctuation" (as we know it) in Koine Greek (the language in which
the New Testament was written). It is a completely contextual
language, strongly inflected. There are breathing marks (which are a
kind of punctuation) in Koine Greek, but again, they are not
punctuation as we would know it.

Don't forget that the Bible was not written in English, and so does
not use English punctuation rules. It was mostly written in ancient
Hebrew, Aramaic, and Koine Greek. ANY punctuation you see in our
modern English Bibles was INSERTED THERE by the translators, according
to the context as they understood it.

They appear to have done a relatively good job of correctly reading
the context. This is because the translators were reading in the
original Biblical languages (English is NOT one of them), and had a
good grasp of both the ancient languages and the languages into which
they were translating the words we now read.

>> ___
>> "franktee" <franktee@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:74650E5D-036B-4AB5-9CD3-67CD1D27CA92@microsoft.com...
>> >
>> > Peace on Earth.
>> > Good will toward men.
>> > Merry Christmas

To which I also add my own prayer for peace on the Earth to men of
good will, as well as my prayer for peace on Earth toward all men.

Christians wish for the best, even for their enemies.
What does the Master say? "Love your enemy when he does not deserve
it, and you will be known as the children of God" (my own
understanding of His teaching.)

But think about this for awhile:
IF God's good will toward men were ONLY toward "men of good will",
ONLY "men of good will" would be able to be saved. But God's grace is
extended toward ALL men, good and evil alike.

As the Patriarchs tell us, "God despises no one, nor does He tell
lies." Do not despise the evil man, since even your Creator doesn't.
We are to be like Him, not the Pharisees, who trumpeted their goodness
before all men, but perverted the Law for their own ends.

I assure you, God's standards of acceptance are much lower than ours,
since He judges a man by his heart, while we judge him by his outward
appearance.


Donald L.McDaniel
Please reply to original thread and newsgroup.
================================================

Donald L McDaniel wrote:
>
> Perhaps you could be giving in spirit yourself, friend.
>
> Also realize that Christmas ("Christ's Day", a very early Christian
> celebration) does NOT have "pagen (sic) foundations", as you claim,
> and as is popularly believed. In fact, His birth has been celebrated
> by the Church since her very beginning, although the central
> celebration of the Church has always been the Eucharistic Meal, of
> course.

Uh, no. Christmas was added by Pope Liberius in 354. The Pope Liberius also
decided on the date of December 25th, the day after the Saturnalia
celebration (in spite of the Gospel declaration that the birth occurred in
the Spring). December 25th was also the day of the sun god, Sol Invictus,
associated with the emperor. Those celebrating the week of Saturnalia could
celebrate one more day, plus the Christians got additional points by
associating one of their holidays with the emperor.

HeyBub wrote:
> Donald L McDaniel wrote:
>> Perhaps you could be giving in spirit yourself, friend.
>>
>> Also realize that Christmas ("Christ's Day", a very early Christian
>> celebration) does NOT have "pagen (sic) foundations", as you claim,
>> and as is popularly believed. In fact, His birth has been celebrated
>> by the Church since her very beginning, although the central
>> celebration of the Church has always been the Eucharistic Meal, of
>> course.
>
> Uh, no. Christmas was added by Pope Liberius in 354. The Pope Liberius also
> decided on the date of December 25th, the day after the Saturnalia
> celebration (in spite of the Gospel declaration that the birth occurred in
> the Spring). December 25th was also the day of the sun god, Sol Invictus,
> associated with the emperor. Those celebrating the week of Saturnalia could
> celebrate one more day, plus the Christians got additional points by
> associating one of their holidays with the emperor.
>
>
>


Additionally, most of the trappings (tree, yule log, holly, etc.) of
the modern Christmas celebration were intentionally stolen from the
northern European pagan celebrations of Yule, under the direction of
Pope Gregory circa 601CE:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yule


--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. ~Benjamin Franklin

Many people would rather die than think; in fact, most do. ~Bertrand Russell

The philosopher has never killed any priests, whereas the priest has
killed a great many philosophers.
~ Denis Diderot

I enjoy a good discourse, and discussion on Christ . Thanks for the details

"Donald L McDaniel" wrote:

> On Mon, 24 Dec 2007 14:47:01 -0800, sgopus
> <sgopus@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>
> >Take your cynical attidtude elsewhere, can you prove the date of Christs
> >birth? NO!
> >so what is one day over another we could have chosen May 19th.
> >Todays Mature Christian say it's not the date it's the intent.
> >So what if Christmas has pagen foundations, ie the tree, if the intent is to
> >celebrate the Birth of Christ it works.
> >
> >Yes companies make money off Christmas, it's the world, so I say don't be
> >cynical, get saved and be a mature Christian, be happy, the kingdom is at
> >hand.
> >
> >Continue to Celebrate the Birth of Christ and be giving in spirit.
>
> Perhaps you could be giving in spirit yourself, friend.
>
> Also realize that Christmas ("Christ's Day", a very early Christian
> celebration) does NOT have "pagen (sic) foundations", as you claim,
> and as is popularly believed. In fact, His birth has been celebrated
> by the Church since her very beginning, although the central
> celebration of the Church has always been the Eucharistic Meal, of
> course.
>
> Nevertheless, I understand your desire to put His Death in the
> forefront. It comes pretty "naturally" to one who is a lover of
> Christ.
>
> By the way, a "mature Christian" would not even be involving himself
> in this controversy.
>
> What do the Apostles teach us? "Love covers a multitude of sins".
>
> >
> >"none" wrote:
> >
> >> You've got that scripture wrong franktee! It has been punctuated
> >> incorrectly, thus people typically MISunderstand it! And CHRISTMAS is
> >> not (read NOT) the time of Christ's birth, it the time of making money
> >> for greedy merchants!
> >>
> >> Remember Mat 10:34 & Luke 12:51
>
> Don't be so dogmatic so young, friend. The fact is, there is no
> "punctuation" (as we know it) in Koine Greek (the language in which
> the New Testament was written). It is a completely contextual
> language, strongly inflected. There are breathing marks (which are a
> kind of punctuation) in Koine Greek, but again, they are not
> punctuation as we would know it.
>
> Don't forget that the Bible was not written in English, and so does
> not use English punctuation rules. It was mostly written in ancient
> Hebrew, Aramaic, and Koine Greek. ANY punctuation you see in our
> modern English Bibles was INSERTED THERE by the translators, according
> to the context as they understood it.
>
> They appear to have done a relatively good job of correctly reading
> the context. This is because the translators were reading in the
> original Biblical languages (English is NOT one of them), and had a
> good grasp of both the ancient languages and the languages into which
> they were translating the words we now read.
>
> >> ___
> >> "franktee" <franktee@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> >> news:74650E5D-036B-4AB5-9CD3-67CD1D27CA92@microsoft.com...
> >> >
> >> > Peace on Earth.
> >> > Good will toward men.
> >> > Merry Christmas
>
> To which I also add my own prayer for peace on the Earth to men of
> good will, as well as my prayer for peace on Earth toward all men.
>
> Christians wish for the best, even for their enemies.
> What does the Master say? "Love your enemy when he does not deserve
> it, and you will be known as the children of God" (my own
> understanding of His teaching.)
>
> But think about this for awhile:
> IF God's good will toward men were ONLY toward "men of good will",
> ONLY "men of good will" would be able to be saved. But God's grace is
> extended toward ALL men, good and evil alike.
>
> As the Patriarchs tell us, "God despises no one, nor does He tell
> lies." Do not despise the evil man, since even your Creator doesn't.
> We are to be like Him, not the Pharisees, who trumpeted their goodness
> before all men, but perverted the Law for their own ends.
>
> I assure you, God's standards of acceptance are much lower than ours,
> since He judges a man by his heart, while we judge him by his outward
> appearance.
>
>
> Donald L.McDaniel
> Please reply to original thread and newsgroup.
> ================================================
>

"Donald L McDaniel" <orthocrossATcomcastDOTnet> wrote in message
news:nq91n31j5701ers1o7d8m9t2ub1tbmgk30@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 24 Dec 2007 14:47:01 -0800, sgopus
> <sgopus@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>
>>Take your cynical attidtude elsewhere, can you prove the date of Christs
>>birth? NO!
>>so what is one day over another we could have chosen May 19th.
>>Todays Mature Christian say it's not the date it's the intent.
>>So what if Christmas has pagen foundations, ie the tree, if the intent is
>>to
>>celebrate the Birth of Christ it works.
>>
>>Yes companies make money off Christmas, it's the world, so I say don't be
>>cynical, get saved and be a mature Christian, be happy, the kingdom is at
>>hand.
>>
>>Continue to Celebrate the Birth of Christ and be giving in spirit.
>
> Perhaps you could be giving in spirit yourself, friend.
>
> Also realize that Christmas ("Christ's Day", a very early Christian
> celebration) does NOT have "pagen (sic) foundations", as you claim,
> and as is popularly believed. In fact, His birth has been celebrated
> by the Church since her very beginning, although the central
> celebration of the Church has always been the Eucharistic Meal, of
> course.

The Eucharist being the central celebration of the Church is not for all who
are Chirstians. This is primarily for Roman Cathlolics, not most
Protestants. "The Church" is not just the Roman Catholic Church but rather
the "catholic Chruch" (note the lower case "c"0 which is simply the
worldwide church of believing Christians regardless of denomination. The
Eucharist (or "Holy Communion" as some of us Protestants refer to it) is one
of two sacraments and it is not "celebrated" at most Sunday services but
rather once a month or so. It is not the central part of a service for
some. Neither is it sacrificial as some believe as Christ was the ultimate
and final sacrifice so there is no need for any other (refer to the Book of
Hebrews which illustrates this quite well).

=======================================

Christmas as the general public knows it, didn't start till after the 1900's
and lets look at the symbols of christmas, take Santa Claus, the red of his
suit comes from trademark used in a commericial for Coca Cola, nothing to do
with Christs blood, the figure of Santa came from the same commericial. the
tree came from the wicca's in worshiping nature (pagen) same with the Wreaths
and Mistletoe, nothing to do with Christ. So as time went by the Church
decided we (the general christian) need a day to celebrate his Birth Voila,
the 25th of Dec.
Sure the Bible says shepards in the fields, that says around spring, not the
winter months, but like I said Todays Christian understands it's the intent,
not so much the symbology

"Donald L McDaniel" wrote:

> On Mon, 24 Dec 2007 14:47:01 -0800, sgopus
> <sgopus@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>
> >Take your cynical attidtude elsewhere, can you prove the date of Christs
> >birth? NO!
> >so what is one day over another we could have chosen May 19th.
> >Todays Mature Christian say it's not the date it's the intent.
> >So what if Christmas has pagen foundations, ie the tree, if the intent is to
> >celebrate the Birth of Christ it works.
> >
> >Yes companies make money off Christmas, it's the world, so I say don't be
> >cynical, get saved and be a mature Christian, be happy, the kingdom is at
> >hand.
> >
> >Continue to Celebrate the Birth of Christ and be giving in spirit.
>
> Perhaps you could be giving in spirit yourself, friend.
>
> Also realize that Christmas ("Christ's Day", a very early Christian
> celebration) does NOT have "pagen (sic) foundations", as you claim,
> and as is popularly believed. In fact, His birth has been celebrated
> by the Church since her very beginning, although the central
> celebration of the Church has always been the Eucharistic Meal, of
> course.
>
> Nevertheless, I understand your desire to put His Death in the
> forefront. It comes pretty "naturally" to one who is a lover of
> Christ.
>
> By the way, a "mature Christian" would not even be involving himself
> in this controversy.
>
> What do the Apostles teach us? "Love covers a multitude of sins".
>
> >
> >"none" wrote:
> >
> >> You've got that scripture wrong franktee! It has been punctuated
> >> incorrectly, thus people typically MISunderstand it! And CHRISTMAS is
> >> not (read NOT) the time of Christ's birth, it the time of making money
> >> for greedy merchants!
> >>
> >> Remember Mat 10:34 & Luke 12:51
>
> Don't be so dogmatic so young, friend. The fact is, there is no
> "punctuation" (as we know it) in Koine Greek (the language in which
> the New Testament was written). It is a completely contextual
> language, strongly inflected. There are breathing marks (which are a
> kind of punctuation) in Koine Greek, but again, they are not
> punctuation as we would know it.
>
> Don't forget that the Bible was not written in English, and so does
> not use English punctuation rules. It was mostly written in ancient
> Hebrew, Aramaic, and Koine Greek. ANY punctuation you see in our
> modern English Bibles was INSERTED THERE by the translators, according
> to the context as they understood it.
>
> They appear to have done a relatively good job of correctly reading
> the context. This is because the translators were reading in the
> original Biblical languages (English is NOT one of them), and had a
> good grasp of both the ancient languages and the languages into which
> they were translating the words we now read.
>
> >> ___
> >> "franktee" <franktee@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> >> news:74650E5D-036B-4AB5-9CD3-67CD1D27CA92@microsoft.com...
> >> >
> >> > Peace on Earth.
> >> > Good will toward men.
> >> > Merry Christmas
>
> To which I also add my own prayer for peace on the Earth to men of
> good will, as well as my prayer for peace on Earth toward all men.
>
> Christians wish for the best, even for their enemies.
> What does the Master say? "Love your enemy when he does not deserve
> it, and you will be known as the children of God" (my own
> understanding of His teaching.)
>
> But think about this for awhile:
> IF God's good will toward men were ONLY toward "men of good will",
> ONLY "men of good will" would be able to be saved. But God's grace is
> extended toward ALL men, good and evil alike.
>
> As the Patriarchs tell us, "God despises no one, nor does He tell
> lies." Do not despise the evil man, since even your Creator doesn't.
> We are to be like Him, not the Pharisees, who trumpeted their goodness
> before all men, but perverted the Law for their own ends.
>
> I assure you, God's standards of acceptance are much lower than ours,
> since He judges a man by his heart, while we judge him by his outward
> appearance.
>
>
> Donald L.McDaniel
> Please reply to original thread and newsgroup.
> ================================================
>

On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:01:01 -0800, sgopus
<sgopus@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> Christmas as the general public knows it, didn't start till after the 1900's


We are all guilty of an occasional off-topic post now and then, but
this thread has gone on for a long time, and is by now taking on a
life of its own.

Can you guys please take this to private E-mail or some other
newsgroup where it's appropriate.

--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
Please Reply to the Newsgroup