[On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers is
positive, the software will go into production by the end of the month.]

I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
..Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This OS
is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations frequently
hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups, GUI problems,
view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off Aero Glass right
now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these stupid icons (like
the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post- read / unread /
replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix those? It's been
talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove to us how bad things
can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't even revert to previous
view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to us than XP? Boy MS has
dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's happened to their design team-
they've managed to make everything less usable. It kinda makes you look on
XP fondly- those were the days... When things were intuitive.


"As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
reliability, and compatibility," he said."


"Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
sent crash data back to Microsoft."

Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
reality, it's sleazy.

What kind of system do you have?
If your having all those problems there must be something up with your
system
I haven't had any of those problems at all
I use a video card which is at the lower end of the scale (Nvidia 6200 256Mb
agp)
and Aero Glass has always worked without any issues at all and my system is
just as fast if Glass is turned of.
my system specs are

Asus P4P800S-X mobo
P4 3.0 prescott Core Ht enabled
1Gb (2X 512Mb) DDR Ram
Nvidia 6200 256 Mb Agp
Kingston Data traveller 512Mb (Ready Boost)
Western Digital 40Gb ide (primary hdd C:drive)
Western Digital 250Gb sata (secondary hdd D: drive)
This is by no means a high end system but I haven't had any major issues at
all with any of the released versions of vista
No BSODS at all so far yet the only issues I have had are directly related
to third party drivers and software.


"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
> month.]
>
> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
> things were intuitive.
>
>
> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>
>
> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>
> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
> reality, it's sleazy.[/color]

The NYTimes article is here:

[url]http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/09/technology/09vista.html?ref=technology[/url]

October 9, 2006
A Challenge for Exterminators
By JOHN MARKOFF
REDMOND, Wash., Oct. 5 - On a whiteboard in a windowless Microsoft
conference room here, an elegant curve drawn by a software-testing engineer
captures both five years of frustration and more recent progress.

The principle behind the curve - that 80 percent of the consequences come
from 20 percent of the causes - is rooted in a 19th-century observation
about the distribution of wealth. But it also illustrates the challenge for
the builders of the next generation of Windows and Office, the world's
largest-selling software packages.

As they scramble to get the programs to users by the end of the year, the
equation is a simple one: making software reliable for most personal
computer users is relatively easy; it is another matter, in a PC universe
with tens of thousands of peripherals and software applications, to defeat
the remaining bugs that cause significant problems for some users.

The effort to overhaul the Windows operating system, originally code-named
Longhorn and since renamed Vista, was meant to offer a transformation to a
new software foundation. But several ambitious initiatives failed to
materialize in time, and the project started over from scratch three years
ago. The result is more an evolutionary shift, focusing on visual
modernization and ease of use.

Still, the company is within a month of completing work on new versions of
both Windows and Office, having apparently overcome technical hurdles that
as recently as August seemed to signal a quagmire.

"It looked bleak; it was a slog, but in the end this was a technical
problem, and there was a turning point," said Bharat Shyam, 37, a computer
scientist who is director of Windows program management. "We've confounded
the analysts and the press."

As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
reliability, and compatibility," he said.

[On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers is
positive, the software will go into production by the end of the month.]

The debugging process has been urgent, with Microsoft scheduled to introduce
Windows Vista and Office 2007 to corporate customers by the end of the year,
and to home users early next year.

This coordinated introduction is a multibillion-dollar proposition for
Microsoft, which has Windows running on some 845 million computers worldwide
and Office on more than 450 million, according to the market research firm
Gartner.

Indeed, it was the vast scale of the Windows testing program that saved the
software development projects. Over the summer, the company began an
extraordinary bug-tracking effort, abetted by volunteers and corporate
partners who ran free copies of both Windows and Office designed to send
data detailing each crash back to Microsoft computers.

The Office package, for example, has been tested by more than 3.5 million
users; last month alone, more than 700,000 PC's were running the software,
generating more than 46 million separate work sessions. At Microsoft, 53,000
employee computers are running test versions.

Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
sent crash data back to Microsoft.

Such data supplements the company's own testing in a center for Office
referred to as the Big Button Room, for the array of switches, lights and
other apparatus that fill the space. (A similar Vista room has a less
interesting name - Windows Test Technologies.)

This is where special software automatically exercises programs rapidly
while looking for errors.

The testing effort for Windows Vista has been led by Mario Garzia, Microsoft's
director of Windows reliability. A former Bell Labs software engineer, Mr.
Garzia says the complexity of the Vista and Office effort dwarfs anything he
undertook for the nation's telephone network.

"Everything is easy if you do it for a limited number of things," he said.
"When I was at Bell Labs, the problems were complex, but nothing compared to
this."

The test data from the second beta release of Vista alone generated 5.5
petabytes of information - the equivalent of the storage capacity of 690,000
home PC's.

The resulting complexity can be seen in the dance that has gone on in recent
months between Microsoft's designers and its partners, who have been
tailoring software and hardware to work with Vista.

On Sept. 1, for example, Microsoft released a version of Vista called
Release Candidate 1 to a large group of outside testers, hoping to take
advantage of their free time over the Labor Day weekend.

Immediately, Mr. Garzia recalled, a wave of crash data fed back to Microsoft
disclosed a newly introduced bug that had been created by incompatibility
with a software module (referred to as a device driver) written by a partner
company.

That company was alerted to the problem, and a remedy was transmitted
directly to the testers' computers over the Internet within four days - a
vast improvement in the gap between detection and repair, he said.

Despite the impending commercial arrival of the two software projects -
which between them have involved the labors of more than 5,000 programmers
and testers here - there is still uncertainty in the industry about how long
it will take for Vista in particular to gain acceptance.

"We've been impressed with the progress, and they deserve a lot of credit,"
said David Smith, a Gartner vice president, but that does not mean that
Windows Vista will soon be in standard workplace use. Its deployment on a
significant scale will not begin at most companies until 2008, Mr. Smith
said.

Microsoft executives contend that such calculations are overly conservative,
and they have been making the case that the use of Vista could pay for
itself in saved labor and related costs in less than a year.

A more fundamental question for the industry is whether Vista will represent
a new era for computing or be the last great push of the current epoch.

While Microsoft's co-founder and chairman, Bill Gates, was able to turn his
company abruptly in the mid-1990's to respond to the challenge posed by
Netscape, Microsoft has proved less effective in blunting a similar
challenge to its dominance from Google.

Moreover, the rise of Google and other companies moving toward
Internet-based software development raises doubts about the value of giant
efforts like Windows and Office, which can take more than five years.

Eric E. Schmidt, chief executive of Google, has said he believes that the
rise of advertising-supported Web services will increasingly undercut
Microsoft's software development model - using a proprietary software
development system and selling shrink-wrapped applications.

In an internal company memo titled "Don't Bet Against the Internet," he
wrote recently, "Almost no pure PC software companies are left (all is on
the Internet), most proprietary standards (I'm thinking of Exchange e-mail
and file systems protocols from Microsoft) are under attack from open
protocols gaining share rapidly on the Internet."

The larger struggle has had little influence on Ben Canning, who began his
career at Microsoft testing software nine years ago after getting a graduate
degree in philosophy from Reed College.

Rather, his days are consumed with working his way down that whiteboard
curve.

Mr. Canning acknowledges that his degree prepared him for little beyond
teaching philosophy - with the possible exception of finding and killing
bugs in software, because philosophers are trained to analyze and solve
particularly hard logical problems. For the last few months, his mind has
been focused on the hard problems at the end of the curve.

"If you look at the mean time to crash for most Office customers, it's very
high," he said. "There is a small minority that crash all the time, and they
hate us, and we want to help."

CH



"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
> month.]
>
> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
> things were intuitive.
>
>
> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>
>
> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>
> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
> reality, it's sleazy.[/color]

Hi

Below is the Everest Report. The system is a Dell laptop, around a month old, and is very fast in Windows XP- Sub ~20s boot time. There are no hardware issues.


Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate 6.0.5744 (Vista Beta)
Date 2006-10-09
Time 01:46


--------[ Summary ]-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Computer:
Computer Type ACPI x86-based PC
Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate
OS Service Pack -
Internet Explorer 7.0.5744.16384
DirectX 4.09.00.0904 (DirectX 9.0c)
Computer Name DMRV-PC
User Name DMRV
Logon Domain DMRV-PC
Date / Time 2006-10-09 / 01:46

Motherboard:
CPU Type Mobile DualCore Intel Core Duo, 1600 MHz (12 x 133)
Motherboard Name Dell Inspiron 6400/E1505
Motherboard Chipset Mobile Intel Calistoga i945PM
System Memory 1024 MB (DDR2-533 DDR2 SDRAM)
BIOS Type Phoenix (07/28/06)

Display:
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
3D Accelerator nVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Monitor Generic PnP Monitor [NoDB]

Multimedia:
Audio Adapter SigmaTel STAC9200 @ Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - High Definition Audio Controller [A-1]

Storage:
IDE Controller Intel(R) 82801GBM/GHM (ICH7-M Family) Serial ATA Storage Controller - 27C4
SCSI/RAID Controller Microsoft iSCSI Initiator
Disk Drive Hitachi HTS541080G9SA00 ATA Device (80 GB, 5400 RPM, SATA)
Optical Drive TSSTcorp DVD+-RW TS-L632D ATA Device
SMART Hard Disks Status OK

Input:
Keyboard Standard 101/102-Key or Microsoft Natural PS/2 Keyboard
Mouse HID-compliant mouse
Mouse PS/2 Compatible Mouse

Network:
Primary IP Address 192.168.1.67
Primary MAC Address 00-18-DE-0E-16-7C
Network Adapter Bluetooth Device (Personal Area Network)
Network Adapter Broadcom 440x 10/100 Integrated Controller
Network Adapter Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 3945ABG Network Connection (192.168.1.67)
Modem Conexant HDA D110 MDC V.92 Modem

Peripherals:
Printer Adobe PDF
Printer Fax
Printer Microsoft Office Document Image Writer
Printer Microsoft XPS Document Writer
FireWire Controller Ricoh RL5C832 IEEE1394 Controller (PHY: Ricoh RL5C832)
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB2 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - Enhanced USB2 Controller [A-1]
USB Device Dell Truemobile 355 Bluetooth + EDR
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
Battery Microsoft AC Adapter
Battery Microsoft ACPI-Compliant Control Method Battery

DMI:
DMI BIOS Vendor Dell Inc.
DMI BIOS Version A08
DMI System Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI System Product MM061
DMI System Version
DMI System Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI System UUID 44454C4C-3100104B-804BB3C0-4F4E4231
DMI Motherboard Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Motherboard Product 0XD720
DMI Motherboard Version
DMI Motherboard Serial Number ..31KKNB1.CN486436832205.
DMI Chassis Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Chassis Version
DMI Chassis Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI Chassis Asset Tag
DMI Chassis Type Portable


"Will" <imagine_44******.com> wrote in message news:A619FCF9-4813-4055-95DC-3FEA9646C433@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> What kind of system do you have?
> If your having all those problems there must be something up with your
> system
> I haven't had any of those problems at all
> I use a video card which is at the lower end of the scale (Nvidia 6200 256Mb
> agp)
> and Aero Glass has always worked without any issues at all and my system is
> just as fast if Glass is turned of.
> my system specs are
>
> Asus P4P800S-X mobo
> P4 3.0 prescott Core Ht enabled
> 1Gb (2X 512Mb) DDR Ram
> Nvidia 6200 256 Mb Agp
> Kingston Data traveller 512Mb (Ready Boost)
> Western Digital 40Gb ide (primary hdd C:drive)
> Western Digital 250Gb sata (secondary hdd D: drive)
> This is by no means a high end system but I haven't had any major issues at
> all with any of the released versions of vista
> No BSODS at all so far yet the only issues I have had are directly related
> to third party drivers and software.
>
>
> "PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
> news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=green]
>> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
>> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
>> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
>> month.]
>>
>> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
>> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
>> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
>> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
>> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
>> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
>> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
>> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
>> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
>> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
>> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
>> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
>> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
>> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
>> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
>> things were intuitive.
>>
>>
>> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
>> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
>> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
>> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
>> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>>
>>
>> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
>> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
>> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>>
>> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
>> reality, it's sleazy. [/color]
>[/color]

"Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before the end of this
month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee"

That won't help.
None of the bugs I reported for RC1 have been fixed in RC2.
Roll on Service Pack 1.


"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
> month.]
>
> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
> things were intuitive.
>
>
> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>
>
> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>
> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
> reality, it's sleazy.[/color]

I see some negatives already.

1). Dell
2). Intel

Nuff said

Gary MCSE


"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message news:6EE3258B-68B3-45B3-8D10-8E74EEF4286B@microsoft.com...
Hi

Below is the Everest Report. The system is a Dell laptop, around a month old, and is very fast in Windows XP- Sub ~20s boot time. There are no hardware issues.


Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate 6.0.5744 (Vista Beta)
Date 2006-10-09
Time 01:46


--------[ Summary ]-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Computer:
Computer Type ACPI x86-based PC
Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate
OS Service Pack -
Internet Explorer 7.0.5744.16384
DirectX 4.09.00.0904 (DirectX 9.0c)
Computer Name DMRV-PC
User Name DMRV
Logon Domain DMRV-PC
Date / Time 2006-10-09 / 01:46

Motherboard:
CPU Type Mobile DualCore Intel Core Duo, 1600 MHz (12 x 133)
Motherboard Name Dell Inspiron 6400/E1505
Motherboard Chipset Mobile Intel Calistoga i945PM
System Memory 1024 MB (DDR2-533 DDR2 SDRAM)
BIOS Type Phoenix (07/28/06)

Display:
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
3D Accelerator nVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Monitor Generic PnP Monitor [NoDB]

Multimedia:
Audio Adapter SigmaTel STAC9200 @ Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - High Definition Audio Controller [A-1]

Storage:
IDE Controller Intel(R) 82801GBM/GHM (ICH7-M Family) Serial ATA Storage Controller - 27C4
SCSI/RAID Controller Microsoft iSCSI Initiator
Disk Drive Hitachi HTS541080G9SA00 ATA Device (80 GB, 5400 RPM, SATA)
Optical Drive TSSTcorp DVD+-RW TS-L632D ATA Device
SMART Hard Disks Status OK

Input:
Keyboard Standard 101/102-Key or Microsoft Natural PS/2 Keyboard
Mouse HID-compliant mouse
Mouse PS/2 Compatible Mouse

Network:
Primary IP Address 192.168.1.67
Primary MAC Address 00-18-DE-0E-16-7C
Network Adapter Bluetooth Device (Personal Area Network)
Network Adapter Broadcom 440x 10/100 Integrated Controller
Network Adapter Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 3945ABG Network Connection (192.168.1.67)
Modem Conexant HDA D110 MDC V.92 Modem

Peripherals:
Printer Adobe PDF
Printer Fax
Printer Microsoft Office Document Image Writer
Printer Microsoft XPS Document Writer
FireWire Controller Ricoh RL5C832 IEEE1394 Controller (PHY: Ricoh RL5C832)
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB2 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - Enhanced USB2 Controller [A-1]
USB Device Dell Truemobile 355 Bluetooth + EDR
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
Battery Microsoft AC Adapter
Battery Microsoft ACPI-Compliant Control Method Battery

DMI:
DMI BIOS Vendor Dell Inc.
DMI BIOS Version A08
DMI System Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI System Product MM061
DMI System Version
DMI System Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI System UUID 44454C4C-3100104B-804BB3C0-4F4E4231
DMI Motherboard Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Motherboard Product 0XD720
DMI Motherboard Version
DMI Motherboard Serial Number ..31KKNB1.CN486436832205.
DMI Chassis Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Chassis Version
DMI Chassis Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI Chassis Asset Tag
DMI Chassis Type Portable


"Will" <imagine_44******.com> wrote in message news:A619FCF9-4813-4055-95DC-3FEA9646C433@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> What kind of system do you have?
> If your having all those problems there must be something up with your
> system
> I haven't had any of those problems at all
> I use a video card which is at the lower end of the scale (Nvidia 6200 256Mb
> agp)
> and Aero Glass has always worked without any issues at all and my system is
> just as fast if Glass is turned of.
> my system specs are
>
> Asus P4P800S-X mobo
> P4 3.0 prescott Core Ht enabled
> 1Gb (2X 512Mb) DDR Ram
> Nvidia 6200 256 Mb Agp
> Kingston Data traveller 512Mb (Ready Boost)
> Western Digital 40Gb ide (primary hdd C:drive)
> Western Digital 250Gb sata (secondary hdd D: drive)
> This is by no means a high end system but I haven't had any major issues at
> all with any of the released versions of vista
> No BSODS at all so far yet the only issues I have had are directly related
> to third party drivers and software.
>
>
> "PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
> news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=green]
>> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
>> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
>> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
>> month.]
>>
>> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
>> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
>> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
>> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
>> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
>> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
>> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
>> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
>> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
>> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
>> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
>> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
>> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
>> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
>> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
>> things were intuitive.
>>
>>
>> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
>> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
>> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
>> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
>> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>>
>>
>> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
>> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
>> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>>
>> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
>> reality, it's sleazy. [/color]
>[/color]

Other than one Mail issue, my RC1 (updated) works flawlessly. That's my
reality. It's quite possible that tens of thousands of other test machines
are running fine (or better), as well.

I'm not a Microsoft apologist (don't work there, don't own stock, etc), but,
I'll bet it's a ****ed tall undertaking to write an OS that works with EVERY
POSSIBLE ITERATION of computer hardware/software.

Now, you can say that "Other software vendors do it all the time." Yes,
that's true, but this is the OS, not just an application. This is the
framework that all those applications run under.

I know... "Maybe, but Apple / Sun managed to get it right. THEIR OS is
stable." Well, that is by no means completely true. Both OS's appear to have
fewer issues, but one must consider that neither OS has the same market
penetration that MS does. Frankly, Windows is run on far more computers over
the face of the Earth than both of those OS's combined. Also:

Linux has a "staff" much larger than MS can afford -- seeing as how the bulk
of that "staff" is unpaid. In addition, it's created and run primarily by
tech-types, who are far better equipped to deal with issues (and engineer
solutions) than your 67 year old grandma, or John Q. Public.

Apple's OS (until just recently) is run on virtually proprietary hardware.
With relatively few exceptions, Apple hardware is produced by Apple -- or
tightly controlled by them in that they license other vendors to make
hardware that conforms to their specs. This way, the variations are kept to
a minimum.

With PC's, you have literally tens of thousands of combinations of hardware,
chipsets, firmware versions, etc. In addition, the bulk of Windows users are
NOT tech-types, and are ill-equipped do deal with their own problems.
Microsoft is sort of "****ed if they do, ****ed if they don't", because,
when they change something to please one sector of their user base, another
is unhappy with it. Microsoft has to do a delicate balancing act of trying
to make the product easy to use (and goof proof) for the amateurs, while
making it customizable and "tweakable" for us tech-types. Need an example?
How about the topic of UAC (User Account Control), one of the new security
features in Vista. For anyone not familiar, this feature is part of the
"limited access" philosophy built into Vista that is designed to stop
malware/viruses from infecting the core of the OS. A good idea, to be sure
(especially for amateurs), but, many of us tech-types feel it's un unwelcome
intrusion, an insult, a royal pain in the ***. Yes, it can be disabled
fairly easily -- but there are still complaints.

Will comment more on this another time -- time to get to work ;)




"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
> month.]
>
> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
> things were intuitive.
>
>
> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>
>
> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>
> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
> reality, it's sleazy.[/color]

I see you have a Conexant modem installed. I have a Zoom modem with that chipset, so I suppose they are close. Mine hasn't worked since 5600 and gives blue screens if booted with modem enabled. If you don't use it, you might try disabling it to see if it would help.

Clark

"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message news:6EE3258B-68B3-45B3-8D10-8E74EEF4286B@microsoft.com...
Hi

Below is the Everest Report. The system is a Dell laptop, around a month old, and is very fast in Windows XP- Sub ~20s boot time. There are no hardware issues.


Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate 6.0.5744 (Vista Beta)
Date 2006-10-09
Time 01:46


--------[ Summary ]-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Computer:
Computer Type ACPI x86-based PC
Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate
OS Service Pack -
Internet Explorer 7.0.5744.16384
DirectX 4.09.00.0904 (DirectX 9.0c)
Computer Name DMRV-PC
User Name DMRV
Logon Domain DMRV-PC
Date / Time 2006-10-09 / 01:46

Motherboard:
CPU Type Mobile DualCore Intel Core Duo, 1600 MHz (12 x 133)
Motherboard Name Dell Inspiron 6400/E1505
Motherboard Chipset Mobile Intel Calistoga i945PM
System Memory 1024 MB (DDR2-533 DDR2 SDRAM)
BIOS Type Phoenix (07/28/06)

Display:
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
3D Accelerator nVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Monitor Generic PnP Monitor [NoDB]

Multimedia:
Audio Adapter SigmaTel STAC9200 @ Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - High Definition Audio Controller [A-1]

Storage:
IDE Controller Intel(R) 82801GBM/GHM (ICH7-M Family) Serial ATA Storage Controller - 27C4
SCSI/RAID Controller Microsoft iSCSI Initiator
Disk Drive Hitachi HTS541080G9SA00 ATA Device (80 GB, 5400 RPM, SATA)
Optical Drive TSSTcorp DVD+-RW TS-L632D ATA Device
SMART Hard Disks Status OK

Input:
Keyboard Standard 101/102-Key or Microsoft Natural PS/2 Keyboard
Mouse HID-compliant mouse
Mouse PS/2 Compatible Mouse

Network:
Primary IP Address 192.168.1.67
Primary MAC Address 00-18-DE-0E-16-7C
Network Adapter Bluetooth Device (Personal Area Network)
Network Adapter Broadcom 440x 10/100 Integrated Controller
Network Adapter Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 3945ABG Network Connection (192.168.1.67)
Modem Conexant HDA D110 MDC V.92 Modem

Peripherals:
Printer Adobe PDF
Printer Fax
Printer Microsoft Office Document Image Writer
Printer Microsoft XPS Document Writer
FireWire Controller Ricoh RL5C832 IEEE1394 Controller (PHY: Ricoh RL5C832)
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB2 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - Enhanced USB2 Controller [A-1]
USB Device Dell Truemobile 355 Bluetooth + EDR
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
Battery Microsoft AC Adapter
Battery Microsoft ACPI-Compliant Control Method Battery

DMI:
DMI BIOS Vendor Dell Inc.
DMI BIOS Version A08
DMI System Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI System Product MM061
DMI System Version
DMI System Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI System UUID 44454C4C-3100104B-804BB3C0-4F4E4231
DMI Motherboard Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Motherboard Product 0XD720
DMI Motherboard Version
DMI Motherboard Serial Number ..31KKNB1.CN486436832205.
DMI Chassis Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Chassis Version
DMI Chassis Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI Chassis Asset Tag
DMI Chassis Type Portable


"Will" <imagine_44******.com> wrote in message news:A619FCF9-4813-4055-95DC-3FEA9646C433@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> What kind of system do you have?
> If your having all those problems there must be something up with your
> system
> I haven't had any of those problems at all
> I use a video card which is at the lower end of the scale (Nvidia 6200 256Mb
> agp)
> and Aero Glass has always worked without any issues at all and my system is
> just as fast if Glass is turned of.
> my system specs are
>
> Asus P4P800S-X mobo
> P4 3.0 prescott Core Ht enabled
> 1Gb (2X 512Mb) DDR Ram
> Nvidia 6200 256 Mb Agp
> Kingston Data traveller 512Mb (Ready Boost)
> Western Digital 40Gb ide (primary hdd C:drive)
> Western Digital 250Gb sata (secondary hdd D: drive)
> This is by no means a high end system but I haven't had any major issues at
> all with any of the released versions of vista
> No BSODS at all so far yet the only issues I have had are directly related
> to third party drivers and software.
>
>
> "PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
> news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=green]
>> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
>> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
>> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
>> month.]
>>
>> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
>> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
>> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
>> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
>> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
>> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
>> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
>> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
>> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
>> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
>> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
>> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
>> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
>> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
>> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
>> things were intuitive.
>>
>>
>> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
>> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
>> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
>> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
>> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>>
>>
>> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
>> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
>> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>>
>> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
>> reality, it's sleazy. [/color]
>[/color]

Intel Inside wrote:
[color=blue]
> "Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before the end of this
> month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee"
>
> That won't help.
> None of the bugs I reported for RC1 have been fixed in RC2.
> Roll on Service Pack 1.
>
>[/color]

Despite no feedback, several of my bugs in RC1 were fixed in build 5728.
No more in RC2 though.

Once again I am just infuriated that we cannot see the status reports,
even on our own bug reports. Makes no sense.

David Wilkinson

I see no problems with the Dell laptop looks ike a very good system.
But I'm certain that most of your problems are related to third party
drivers and compatibility issues
And it's probably I bit harsh to blame Vista for that seeing that it's still
only beta software I'm sure once Vista is released, Dell will pretty much
work around the clock to fix any compatibility and driver issues.
I guess I'm pretty lucky that I have an average system with very liitle
prolems with the new OS.

"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
> month.]
>
> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
> things were intuitive.
>
>
> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>
>
> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>
> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
> reality, it's sleazy.[/color]

Will try that and revert.

Thanks
"Clark" <who@whoknows.com> wrote in message news:%23AGPl756GHA.3732@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
I see you have a Conexant modem installed. I have a Zoom modem with that chipset, so I suppose they are close. Mine hasn't worked since 5600 and gives blue screens if booted with modem enabled. If you don't use it, you might try disabling it to see if it would help.

Clark

"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message news:6EE3258B-68B3-45B3-8D10-8E74EEF4286B@microsoft.com...
Hi

Below is the Everest Report. The system is a Dell laptop, around a month old, and is very fast in Windows XP- Sub ~20s boot time. There are no hardware issues.


Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate 6.0.5744 (Vista Beta)
Date 2006-10-09
Time 01:46


--------[ Summary ]-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Computer:
Computer Type ACPI x86-based PC
Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate
OS Service Pack -
Internet Explorer 7.0.5744.16384
DirectX 4.09.00.0904 (DirectX 9.0c)
Computer Name DMRV-PC
User Name DMRV
Logon Domain DMRV-PC
Date / Time 2006-10-09 / 01:46

Motherboard:
CPU Type Mobile DualCore Intel Core Duo, 1600 MHz (12 x 133)
Motherboard Name Dell Inspiron 6400/E1505
Motherboard Chipset Mobile Intel Calistoga i945PM
System Memory 1024 MB (DDR2-533 DDR2 SDRAM)
BIOS Type Phoenix (07/28/06)

Display:
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
3D Accelerator nVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Monitor Generic PnP Monitor [NoDB]

Multimedia:
Audio Adapter SigmaTel STAC9200 @ Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - High Definition Audio Controller [A-1]

Storage:
IDE Controller Intel(R) 82801GBM/GHM (ICH7-M Family) Serial ATA Storage Controller - 27C4
SCSI/RAID Controller Microsoft iSCSI Initiator
Disk Drive Hitachi HTS541080G9SA00 ATA Device (80 GB, 5400 RPM, SATA)
Optical Drive TSSTcorp DVD+-RW TS-L632D ATA Device
SMART Hard Disks Status OK

Input:
Keyboard Standard 101/102-Key or Microsoft Natural PS/2 Keyboard
Mouse HID-compliant mouse
Mouse PS/2 Compatible Mouse

Network:
Primary IP Address 192.168.1.67
Primary MAC Address 00-18-DE-0E-16-7C
Network Adapter Bluetooth Device (Personal Area Network)
Network Adapter Broadcom 440x 10/100 Integrated Controller
Network Adapter Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 3945ABG Network Connection (192.168.1.67)
Modem Conexant HDA D110 MDC V.92 Modem

Peripherals:
Printer Adobe PDF
Printer Fax
Printer Microsoft Office Document Image Writer
Printer Microsoft XPS Document Writer
FireWire Controller Ricoh RL5C832 IEEE1394 Controller (PHY: Ricoh RL5C832)
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB2 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - Enhanced USB2 Controller [A-1]
USB Device Dell Truemobile 355 Bluetooth + EDR
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
Battery Microsoft AC Adapter
Battery Microsoft ACPI-Compliant Control Method Battery

DMI:
DMI BIOS Vendor Dell Inc.
DMI BIOS Version A08
DMI System Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI System Product MM061
DMI System Version
DMI System Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI System UUID 44454C4C-3100104B-804BB3C0-4F4E4231
DMI Motherboard Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Motherboard Product 0XD720
DMI Motherboard Version
DMI Motherboard Serial Number ..31KKNB1.CN486436832205.
DMI Chassis Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Chassis Version
DMI Chassis Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI Chassis Asset Tag
DMI Chassis Type Portable


"Will" <imagine_44******.com> wrote in message news:A619FCF9-4813-4055-95DC-3FEA9646C433@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> What kind of system do you have?
> If your having all those problems there must be something up with your
> system
> I haven't had any of those problems at all
> I use a video card which is at the lower end of the scale (Nvidia 6200 256Mb
> agp)
> and Aero Glass has always worked without any issues at all and my system is
> just as fast if Glass is turned of.
> my system specs are
>
> Asus P4P800S-X mobo
> P4 3.0 prescott Core Ht enabled
> 1Gb (2X 512Mb) DDR Ram
> Nvidia 6200 256 Mb Agp
> Kingston Data traveller 512Mb (Ready Boost)
> Western Digital 40Gb ide (primary hdd C:drive)
> Western Digital 250Gb sata (secondary hdd D: drive)
> This is by no means a high end system but I haven't had any major issues at
> all with any of the released versions of vista
> No BSODS at all so far yet the only issues I have had are directly related
> to third party drivers and software.
>
>
> "PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
> news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=green]
>> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
>> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
>> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
>> month.]
>>
>> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
>> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
>> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
>> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
>> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
>> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
>> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
>> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
>> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
>> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
>> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
>> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
>> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
>> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
>> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
>> things were intuitive.
>>
>>
>> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
>> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
>> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
>> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
>> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>>
>>
>> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
>> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
>> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>>
>> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
>> reality, it's sleazy. [/color]
>[/color]

"Will" <imagine_44******.com> wrote in message
news:BF06D361-A418-41D5-B98D-F4991512F89C@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
>I see no problems with the Dell laptop looks ike a very good system.
> But I'm certain that most of your problems are related to third party
> drivers and compatibility issues
> And it's probably I bit harsh to blame Vista for that seeing that it's
> still only beta software[/color]

The reason why you're seeing such posts here is that we're just 10 days from
RTM, and RC2 is what MS has come up with. Not much will change between now
and then- Which is really disheartening, since we always have to wait for a
SP before Windows truly becomes great. Remember XP SP1?


I'm sure once Vista is released, Dell will pretty much[color=blue]
> work around the clock to fix any compatibility and driver issues.
> I guess I'm pretty lucky that I have an average system with very liitle
> prolems with the new OS.[/color]

You sure are!
[color=blue]
>
> "PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
> news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=green]
>> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
>> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
>> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
>> month.]
>>
>> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that
>> uses .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported
>> before the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee.
>> This OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
>> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
>> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
>> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
>> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
>> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they
>> fix those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to
>> prove to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that
>> can't even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more
>> difficult to us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder
>> what's happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything
>> less usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the
>> days... When things were intuitive.
>>
>>
>> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
>> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
>> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
>> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
>> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>>
>>
>> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million
>> computer users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the
>> systems have sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>>
>> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
>> reality, it's sleazy.[/color]
>[/color]

"jwardl" <jwardl@spamthis.com> wrote in message
news:A9188BDC-9BF8-4F56-A6B9-3970B06E8FBF@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> Other than one Mail issue, my RC1 (updated) works flawlessly. That's my
> reality. It's quite possible that tens of thousands of other test machines
> are running fine (or better), as well.
>
> I'm not a Microsoft apologist (don't work there, don't own stock, etc),
> but, I'll bet it's a ****ed tall undertaking to write an OS that works
> with EVERY POSSIBLE ITERATION of computer hardware/software.
>
> Now, you can say that "Other software vendors do it all the time." Yes,
> that's true, but this is the OS, not just an application. This is the
> framework that all those applications run under.
>
> I know... "Maybe, but Apple / Sun managed to get it right. THEIR OS is
> stable." Well, that is by no means completely true. Both OS's appear to
> have fewer issues, but one must consider that neither OS has the same
> market penetration that MS does. Frankly, Windows is run on far more
> computers over the face of the Earth than both of those OS's combined.
> Also:
>
> Linux has a "staff" much larger than MS can afford -- seeing as how the
> bulk of that "staff" is unpaid. In addition, it's created and run
> primarily by tech-types, who are far better equipped to deal with issues
> (and engineer solutions) than your 67 year old grandma, or John Q. Public.
>
> Apple's OS (until just recently) is run on virtually proprietary hardware.
> With relatively few exceptions, Apple hardware is produced by Apple -- or
> tightly controlled by them in that they license other vendors to make
> hardware that conforms to their specs. This way, the variations are kept
> to a minimum.
>
> With PC's, you have literally tens of thousands of combinations of
> hardware, chipsets, firmware versions, etc.[/color]

You seem to misinterpret my post. It's not a plea for other OSes- because I
know we are far better off in that department. What I need it know is where
that claim for MS producing the highest quality OS ever went. They don't
seem to even be living up to the quality of XP SP2. The problems are not
just hardware centric- There are software issues too- Software that claims
to be Vista certified.


In addition, the bulk of Windows users are[color=blue]
> NOT tech-types, and are ill-equipped do deal with their own problems.
> Microsoft is sort of "****ed if they do, ****ed if they don't",[/color]

This actually makes the situation far worse. I prognosticate 2000+ posts
per day in this very group when Vista goes gold. Many of them would be
asking how to do things they took for granted- things like Add-Remove,
desktop settings and where their download went, others will cry about UAC,
there will be widespread paucity of drivers and utter chaos. We'll
experience this - really soon!


because,[color=blue]
> when they change something to please one sector of their user base,
> another is unhappy with it. Microsoft has to do a delicate balancing act
> of trying to make the product easy to use (and goof proof) for the
> amateurs, while making it customizable and "tweakable" for us tech-types.[/color]

How about retaining an option to revert to earlier settings - Like if
someone is pressed for time. (eg. Office2007, the Vista maze you go through
to 'Personalize' the desktop, the start menu (XP style) etc.


Need an example?[color=blue]
> How about the topic of UAC (User Account Control), one of the new security
> features in Vista. For anyone not familiar, this feature is part of the
> "limited access" philosophy built into Vista that is designed to stop
> malware/viruses from infecting the core of the OS. A good idea, to be sure
> (especially for amateurs), but, many of us tech-types feel it's un
> unwelcome intrusion, an insult, a royal pain in the ***. Yes, it can be
> disabled fairly easily -- but there are still complaints.[/color]

I'm now accustomed to turning it off as soon as I install the OS- So I don't
have it babysitting me :-)[color=blue]
>
> Will comment more on this another time -- time to get to work ;)[/color]

Yup, same here!
[color=blue]
>
>
>
>
> "PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
> news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=green]
>> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
>> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
>> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
>> month.]
>>
>> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that
>> uses .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported
>> before the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee.
>> This OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
>> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
>> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
>> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
>> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
>> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they
>> fix those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to
>> prove to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that
>> can't even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more
>> difficult to us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder
>> what's happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything
>> less usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the
>> days... When things were intuitive.
>>
>>
>> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
>> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
>> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
>> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
>> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>>
>>
>> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million
>> computer users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the
>> systems have sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>>
>> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
>> reality, it's sleazy.[/color]
>[/color]

PowerUser wrote:[color=blue]
> "Will" <imagine_44******.com> wrote in message
> news:BF06D361-A418-41D5-B98D-F4991512F89C@microsoft.com...[color=green]
>> I see no problems with the Dell laptop looks ike a very good system.
>> But I'm certain that most of your problems are related to third party
>> drivers and compatibility issues
>> And it's probably I bit harsh to blame Vista for that seeing that it's
>> still only beta software[/color]
>
> The reason why you're seeing such posts here is that we're just 10 days from
> RTM, and RC2 is what MS has come up with. Not much will change between now
> and then- Which is really disheartening, since we always have to wait for a
> SP before Windows truly becomes great. Remember XP SP1?[/color]

First the get the beta checkers to work for free and then they get the
customers to pay to test the unfinished product. Nice scam if you can
pull if off and MS seems very adept at just that.

Alias

Did you bother to read the part where I wrote that everything works perfectly on XP? There is nothing wrong with either of the companies you've mentioned. And for mobile computing, AMD is a joke. They make great desktop processors though (of course they've been comprehensively trounced now) and I own an AMD based desktop too.

Don't go off topic blaming things for no reason.
"Gary MCSE" <kc5md@comcast.net> wrote in message news:10AE5D7F-0D99-41C1-BCE9-07C7AB13D156@microsoft.com...
I see some negatives already.

1). Dell
2). Intel

Nuff said

Gary MCSE


"PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message news:6EE3258B-68B3-45B3-8D10-8E74EEF4286B@microsoft.com...
Hi

Below is the Everest Report. The system is a Dell laptop, around a month old, and is very fast in Windows XP- Sub ~20s boot time. There are no hardware issues.


Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate 6.0.5744 (Vista Beta)
Date 2006-10-09
Time 01:46


--------[ Summary ]-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Computer:
Computer Type ACPI x86-based PC
Operating System Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate
OS Service Pack -
Internet Explorer 7.0.5744.16384
DirectX 4.09.00.0904 (DirectX 9.0c)
Computer Name DMRV-PC
User Name DMRV
Logon Domain DMRV-PC
Date / Time 2006-10-09 / 01:46

Motherboard:
CPU Type Mobile DualCore Intel Core Duo, 1600 MHz (12 x 133)
Motherboard Name Dell Inspiron 6400/E1505
Motherboard Chipset Mobile Intel Calistoga i945PM
System Memory 1024 MB (DDR2-533 DDR2 SDRAM)
BIOS Type Phoenix (07/28/06)

Display:
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
3D Accelerator nVIDIA GeForce Go 7300
Monitor Generic PnP Monitor [NoDB]

Multimedia:
Audio Adapter SigmaTel STAC9200 @ Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - High Definition Audio Controller [A-1]

Storage:
IDE Controller Intel(R) 82801GBM/GHM (ICH7-M Family) Serial ATA Storage Controller - 27C4
SCSI/RAID Controller Microsoft iSCSI Initiator
Disk Drive Hitachi HTS541080G9SA00 ATA Device (80 GB, 5400 RPM, SATA)
Optical Drive TSSTcorp DVD+-RW TS-L632D ATA Device
SMART Hard Disks Status OK

Input:
Keyboard Standard 101/102-Key or Microsoft Natural PS/2 Keyboard
Mouse HID-compliant mouse
Mouse PS/2 Compatible Mouse

Network:
Primary IP Address 192.168.1.67
Primary MAC Address 00-18-DE-0E-16-7C
Network Adapter Bluetooth Device (Personal Area Network)
Network Adapter Broadcom 440x 10/100 Integrated Controller
Network Adapter Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 3945ABG Network Connection (192.168.1.67)
Modem Conexant HDA D110 MDC V.92 Modem

Peripherals:
Printer Adobe PDF
Printer Fax
Printer Microsoft Office Document Image Writer
Printer Microsoft XPS Document Writer
FireWire Controller Ricoh RL5C832 IEEE1394 Controller (PHY: Ricoh RL5C832)
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - USB Universal Host Controller [A-1]
USB2 Controller Intel 82801GBM ICH7-M - Enhanced USB2 Controller [A-1]
USB Device Dell Truemobile 355 Bluetooth + EDR
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
Battery Microsoft AC Adapter
Battery Microsoft ACPI-Compliant Control Method Battery

DMI:
DMI BIOS Vendor Dell Inc.
DMI BIOS Version A08
DMI System Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI System Product MM061
DMI System Version
DMI System Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI System UUID 44454C4C-3100104B-804BB3C0-4F4E4231
DMI Motherboard Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Motherboard Product 0XD720
DMI Motherboard Version
DMI Motherboard Serial Number ..31KKNB1.CN486436832205.
DMI Chassis Manufacturer Dell Inc.
DMI Chassis Version
DMI Chassis Serial Number 31KKNB1
DMI Chassis Asset Tag
DMI Chassis Type Portable


"Will" <imagine_44******.com> wrote in message news:A619FCF9-4813-4055-95DC-3FEA9646C433@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
> What kind of system do you have?
> If your having all those problems there must be something up with your
> system
> I haven't had any of those problems at all
> I use a video card which is at the lower end of the scale (Nvidia 6200 256Mb
> agp)
> and Aero Glass has always worked without any issues at all and my system is
> just as fast if Glass is turned of.
> my system specs are
>
> Asus P4P800S-X mobo
> P4 3.0 prescott Core Ht enabled
> 1Gb (2X 512Mb) DDR Ram
> Nvidia 6200 256 Mb Agp
> Kingston Data traveller 512Mb (Ready Boost)
> Western Digital 40Gb ide (primary hdd C:drive)
> Western Digital 250Gb sata (secondary hdd D: drive)
> This is by no means a high end system but I haven't had any major issues at
> all with any of the released versions of vista
> No BSODS at all so far yet the only issues I have had are directly related
> to third party drivers and software.
>
>
> "PowerUser" <a@b.com> wrote in message
> news:55982EA5-13FE-40EC-94F6-3AD77CB10AF8@microsoft.com...[color=green]
>> [On Friday, the company released what it said would be the final test
>> version of Vista, named Release Candidate 2. If the response from testers
>> is positive, the software will go into production by the end of the
>> month.]
>>
>> I was reading this article in today's NY times (the times reader that uses
>> .Net 3 and WPF). Looks like MS needs a zillion bugs to be reported before
>> the end of this month so that it can wake up and smell the coffee. This
>> OS is NOT ready for production. I keep finding bugs, installations
>> frequently hand and ask for some "recommended reinstallations" lockups,
>> GUI problems, view problems, speed problems (heck I've just turned off
>> Aero Glass right now- Got so sick of it- And it's still slow) and these
>> stupid icons (like the ones that tell you the status of a mail or post-
>> read / unread / replied) that you can't discern easily (why won't they fix
>> those? It's been talked about so much) . Is MS actually trying to prove
>> to us how bad things can get? A completely new Office 2007 (that can't
>> even revert to previous view) and Vista full of bugs and more difficult to
>> us than XP? Boy MS has dug itself into the grave. I wonder what's
>> happened to their design team- they've managed to make everything less
>> usable. It kinda makes you look on XP fondly- those were the days... When
>> things were intuitive.
>>
>>
>> "As October arrived, a vote of confidence came from Wall Street when a
>> Goldman Sachs analyst, Richard G. Sherlund, wrote that he expected the
>> product to be introduced on time. "The Vista development organization has
>> made rapid progress delivering improvements to Vista's performance,
>> reliability, and compatibility," he said."
>>
>>
>> "Vista has also been tested extensively. More than half a million computer
>> users have installed Vista test software, and 450,000 of the systems have
>> sent crash data back to Microsoft."
>>
>> Check out this article. MS tells the press something so different than
>> reality, it's sleazy. [/color]
>[/color]