Mike Hall - MVP wrote:
[color=blue]
> "Canuck57" <dave-no_spam@unixhome.net> wrote in message
> news:xWlCj.86587$pM4.68560@pd7urf1no...[color=green]
>>
>> "Mike Hall - MVP" <mikehall@mvps.com> wrote in message
>> news:eQ9y34RhIHA.4140@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...[color=darkred]
>>> Inline
>>>
>>> "Canuck57" <dave-no_spam@unixhome.net> wrote in message
>>> news:YPaCj.84405$w94.7514@pd7urf2no...
>>>>
>>>
>>>> Mike,
>>>>
>>>> I too have tried Vista 64 bit and 32 bit and had the exact same
>>>> frustrations. I too will not go into a list as it is too long to post
>>>> here.
>>>
>>> Vista did have issues of its own, and have been addressed in the SP1
>>> update which will find its way onto systems very soon.
>>>
>>> But Microsoft is not the whole industry, and for whatever reasons, many
>>> 3rd party manufacturers and software authors showed public intransigence
>>> when it came to writing drivers or updates for anything. Even the MS
>>> keyboard/mice manufacturer played hard to get.
>>>
>>> Some of the manufacturers have back tracked since the early days as
>>> there was no big rush to replace printers, scanners, USB wireless
>>> devices etc. What the manufacturers didn't want was for people to stay
>>> with XP, because then there would be no need for users to replace
>>> anything and they would lose revenue.
>>>
>>> 64bit is still much of a niche, and manufacturers were not prepared to
>>> put time and effort into writing 64bit stuff if hardly anybody was going
>>> to use it. This is changing but slowly.
>>>
>>>> One advantage 64 bit has, is with the OS taking 22% of 8GB of RAM you
>>>> have more free RAM for applications. And yes, I bought a nice GPU to
>>>> replace on > onboard UMA.
>>>>
>>>
>>> For the average user/business workstation there is not a need for more
>>> than 4gb as yet. And integrated video is always a compromise as laptop
>>> owners find out.
>>>
>>>> Vista looks nice, but peal off the fancy glass interface and it is a
>>>> pest to use and customize. Slow on disk copy and network.
>>>
>>> SP1 addresses these issues[/color]
>>
>> SP1, was it not withdrawn once? Not a comforting feeling. And from what
>> I hear, it does break new things.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> Obficated inside, try getting it working with Samba...
>>>
>>> Samba has issues too..[/color]
>>
>> The issue with Samba is Vista. I have used Samba for over 10 years.
>> This is the first MS product it does not work with, and obviously
>> deliberate on
>> MS part. Samba even works with Linux, did you know that?
>>
>> And it's VPN/IPSec works too. Even between different version of Linux,
>> Solaris and devices.
>>[color=darkred]
>>> >Even though I am using it, and power savings off I can hear drives
>>> >cycling
>>> up and down.
>>>
>>> Vista defaults to power saving. It can be changed..[/color]
>>
>> I changed it. I was running Windows 1.0, that did not take long to
>> figure, yet with sleep/conservation off the drives still would cycle. If
>> have problems with it, my guess is very many people do, just haven't
>> burned their drives out yet. But not a problems as of an hour ago.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>>This is beta ware!
>>>
>>> No more than anything else in the IT world..[/color]
>>
>> Yes, but this accelerates the decline. Just that you and MS pundits have
>> accepted it. If Vista was a car, I would be pursuing the lemon law.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> Why does Microsoft not sell or give us the option of which OS at a
>>>> reasonable price? Seriously?
>>>
>>> Fixed overheads, salaries to be paid? They do more than produce Vista..[/color]
>>
>> Huh? XP is sunk cost. Not that much cost to keep it in copy. If I went
>> to Ford, and said I wanted a F150 4x4, I don't think they would say they
>> could only sell me an Edsel.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> Something wrong with "Shall that be Vista or XP?" on it's first boot?
>>>> Is Microsoft grown so arrogant they want to force feed us Vista?
>>>
>>> Like many other software authors, they do not want to have to support
>>> old stuff for ever..[/color]
>>
>> And we don't want to be the beta testers. Maybe Microsoft aught to make
>> all their programers use machines people regularily buy, make them use
>> Vista day in an day out until they get it right. And audit them to make
>> sure they are not cheating.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> Don't tell me if I buy a small disk over priced business system so I
>>>> can
>>>> use XP, I want it on the $1000 home PC. I can't get XP Pro x64 or
>>>> better yet MCE... I can get 32 bit, but that is insufficient. My other
>>>> older PC is MCE and to me it is Microsoft's zenith in OS development.
>>>> I want that one.
>>>
>>> Vista Ultimate replaces that..[/color]
>>
>> Bu11sh1t. I am not spending any more on Vista and at the rate of
>> progress, I will likely retire before I see a SP 4. Ultimate, a chance
>> to bilk people.
>>
>> MS profits are up for the moment because they are double dipping the
>> consumer. Something that will not last. Buy a new machine, Vista only.
>> Then get a XP so things will work. MS-Windows, bought twice runs once.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> I want XP MCE or I will switch to Linux.
>>>
>>> And you think that Linux will be better? Go ahead..[/color]
>>
>> Already did. Dual booting Fedora 8 and SUSE Enterprise to see which one
>> I
>> like best. No hassles either, the boot nicely coexists and isn't myopic
>> like the MS one. Installed right the first time. Even downloaded MythTV
>> for when I get the chance to play.
>>
>> Me, I now run real windows, X-Windows. Stable, compatible and proven.
>> Even runs Office, OpenOffice that is.
>>[/color]
>
>
> Real Windows? hahahaha. I am amazed that you need any kind of Windows
> being as you are into real computing.
>
> Tell me something. Does a document typed out in OO Writer carry more
> weight than the same typed out in Word 2007? Do you need more technical
> prowess to be able to do it?
>
> You anti-MS (or, I suspect anti any large corporation) Linux zealots talk
> the same type of crap as did supporters of DOS when Windows first
> appeared. Apparently, these people were into real computing, meaning that
> one had to be able to remember at least five command line statements to
> get through a day.
>
> Have you amazed your family by opening up a command window and typing in
> 'ipconfig /all'. Weren't they just so impressed with your skill as all of
> the text flashed up onto the screen!!
>[/color]
<snip much bs>

ipconfig /all
bash: ipconfig: command not found

:-) Try again.

Cheers.

--
What does Bill Gates use?
[url]http://tinyurl.com/2zxhdl[/url]

Proprietary Software: a 20th Century software business model.

Be Afraid ... Be Very Afraid ... of Francis' RELATIVES!

Frank, hard at work on his Vista computer all day:
[url]http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/warriorshtm/compost.htm[/url]

NoStop wrote:[color=blue][color=green]
>>[/color]
> <snip much bs>
>
> ipconfig /all
> bash: ipconfig: command not found
>[/color]

Why don't you turn into NoHazard and disappear?

"Mike Hall - MVP" <mikehall@mvps.com> wrote in message
news:Oij2WochIHA.5900@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...[color=blue]
> "Canuck57" <dave-no_spam@unixhome.net> wrote in message
> news:xWlCj.86587$pM4.68560@pd7urf1no...[color=green]
>>
>> "Mike Hall - MVP" <mikehall@mvps.com> wrote in message
>> news:eQ9y34RhIHA.4140@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...[color=darkred]
>>> Inline
>>>
>>> "Canuck57" <dave-no_spam@unixhome.net> wrote in message
>>> news:YPaCj.84405$w94.7514@pd7urf2no...
>>>>
>>>
>>>> Mike,
>>>>
>>>> I too have tried Vista 64 bit and 32 bit and had the exact same
>>>> frustrations. I too will not go into a list as it is too long to post
>>>> here.
>>>
>>> Vista did have issues of its own, and have been addressed in the SP1
>>> update which will find its way onto systems very soon.
>>>
>>> But Microsoft is not the whole industry, and for whatever reasons, many
>>> 3rd party manufacturers and software authors showed public intransigence
>>> when it came to writing drivers or updates for anything. Even the MS
>>> keyboard/mice manufacturer played hard to get.
>>>
>>> Some of the manufacturers have back tracked since the early days as
>>> there was no big rush to replace printers, scanners, USB wireless
>>> devices etc. What the manufacturers didn't want was for people to stay
>>> with XP, because then there would be no need for users to replace
>>> anything and they would lose revenue.
>>>
>>> 64bit is still much of a niche, and manufacturers were not prepared to
>>> put time and effort into writing 64bit stuff if hardly anybody was going
>>> to use it. This is changing but slowly.
>>>
>>>> One advantage 64 bit has, is with the OS taking 22% of 8GB of RAM you
>>>> have more free RAM for applications. And yes, I bought a nice GPU to
>>>> replace on > onboard UMA.
>>>>
>>>
>>> For the average user/business workstation there is not a need for more
>>> than 4gb as yet. And integrated video is always a compromise as laptop
>>> owners find out.
>>>
>>>> Vista looks nice, but peal off the fancy glass interface and it is a
>>>> pest to use and customize. Slow on disk copy and network.
>>>
>>> SP1 addresses these issues[/color]
>>
>> SP1, was it not withdrawn once? Not a comforting feeling. And from what
>> I hear, it does break new things.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> Obficated inside, try getting it working with Samba...
>>>
>>> Samba has issues too..[/color]
>>
>> The issue with Samba is Vista. I have used Samba for over 10 years.
>> This is the first MS product it does not work with, and obviously
>> deliberate on MS part. Samba even works with Linux, did you know that?
>>
>> And it's VPN/IPSec works too. Even between different version of Linux,
>> Solaris and devices.
>>[color=darkred]
>>> >Even though I am using it, and power savings off I can hear drives
>>> >cycling
>>> up and down.
>>>
>>> Vista defaults to power saving. It can be changed..[/color]
>>
>> I changed it. I was running Windows 1.0, that did not take long to
>> figure, yet with sleep/conservation off the drives still would cycle. If
>> have problems with it, my guess is very many people do, just haven't
>> burned their drives out yet. But not a problems as of an hour ago.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>>This is beta ware!
>>>
>>> No more than anything else in the IT world..[/color]
>>
>> Yes, but this accelerates the decline. Just that you and MS pundits have
>> accepted it. If Vista was a car, I would be pursuing the lemon law.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> Why does Microsoft not sell or give us the option of which OS at a
>>>> reasonable price? Seriously?
>>>
>>> Fixed overheads, salaries to be paid? They do more than produce Vista..[/color]
>>
>> Huh? XP is sunk cost. Not that much cost to keep it in copy. If I went
>> to Ford, and said I wanted a F150 4x4, I don't think they would say they
>> could only sell me an Edsel.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> Something wrong with "Shall that be Vista or XP?" on it's first boot?
>>>> Is Microsoft grown so arrogant they want to force feed us Vista?
>>>
>>> Like many other software authors, they do not want to have to support
>>> old stuff for ever..[/color]
>>
>> And we don't want to be the beta testers. Maybe Microsoft aught to make
>> all their programers use machines people regularily buy, make them use
>> Vista day in an day out until they get it right. And audit them to make
>> sure they are not cheating.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> Don't tell me if I buy a small disk over priced business system so I
>>>> can use XP, I want it on the $1000 home PC. I can't get XP Pro x64 or
>>>> better yet MCE... I can get 32 bit, but that is insufficient. My other
>>>> older PC is MCE and to me it is Microsoft's zenith in OS development.
>>>> I want that one.
>>>
>>> Vista Ultimate replaces that..[/color]
>>
>> Bu11sh1t. I am not spending any more on Vista and at the rate of
>> progress, I will likely retire before I see a SP 4. Ultimate, a chance
>> to bilk people.
>>
>> MS profits are up for the moment because they are double dipping the
>> consumer. Something that will not last. Buy a new machine, Vista only.
>> Then get a XP so things will work. MS-Windows, bought twice runs once.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> I want XP MCE or I will switch to Linux.
>>>
>>> And you think that Linux will be better? Go ahead..[/color]
>>
>> Already did. Dual booting Fedora 8 and SUSE Enterprise to see which one
>> I like best. No hassles either, the boot nicely coexists and isn't
>> myopic like the MS one. Installed right the first time. Even downloaded
>> MythTV for when I get the chance to play.
>>
>> Me, I now run real windows, X-Windows. Stable, compatible and proven.
>> Even runs Office, OpenOffice that is.
>>[/color]
>
>
> Real Windows? hahahaha. I am amazed that you need any kind of Windows
> being as you are into real computing.[/color]

Yep, seasoned and reliable. Also works between vendors and is efficient
over the network. You should try it.

None of my servers however do I run graphics, I leave it off so the CPU and
memory can go towards the application at hand.
[color=blue]
> Tell me something. Does a document typed out in OO Writer carry more
> weight than the same typed out in Word 2007? Do you need more technical
> prowess to be able to do it?[/color]

I do like the idea of ODF, for if it wasn't open I wouldn't have switched.
But using one, or the other it isn't hard to switch. In fact, I do daily.
Some of my clients like ODF, some like it DOC. OpenOffice saves both. In
fact saves in older DOC formats as not all clients are that new, a feature I
like. But if on a clients PC, I use MS-Office if that is what they use.
[color=blue]
> You anti-MS (or, I suspect anti any large corporation) Linux zealots talk
> the same type of crap as did supporters of DOS when Windows first
> appeared. Apparently, these people were into real computing, meaning that
> one had to be able to remember at least five command line statements to
> get through a day.[/color]

I am not a myopic chair mushroom worshiping a false god and know technolgoy
comes, and it goes. I have used quite a few OSes behind me in the last
20-30 years. VAX, MVS, Windows 1.0 to Vista, including ever DOS since 2.10,
at least the top 10 UNIXes of the last 20 years, 3 BSDs and was into Linux
with Slackware .91 or something like that. Even did OS/2, Novell and pSOS,
vxWorks and others like MPE, CPM, TRS-DOS.

I specialize in C/C++ and Java, but can do almost any UNIX shell. Rusty,
but have done Visual Basic, Fortran, MFC, Motif, and lots I forget.

If MS can't take some critizism, too freaking bad.
[color=blue]
> Have you amazed your family by opening up a command window and typing in
> 'ipconfig /all'. Weren't they just so impressed with your skill as all of
> the text flashed up onto the screen!![/color]

Actually, you would be surprised at home many MSCE I have taught that too.
Netstat is another.

Had more than one case of a VB app, opening resources on the network with
the MS API flavor of the day and they couldn't find it.

Took me less that 5 minutes...
[color=blue]
> With your ability, you shouldn't have to ever buy a Windows computer. Just
> throw a few parts together on the kitchen table, load up Fedora and hey
> presto, a real computer for a real computer user. I'm impressed, can't you
> tell?[/color]

Done that too. Most of mine in the past are home built. Even ran W2000 on
a dual celeraon mobo once. But for the price of parts, it is cheaper to buy
and add a decent video, add to the MS coaster collection and do it that way.

Microsoft will never admit how many copies of their OS they ship that never
boot up once.
[color=blue]
> The trouble is that 99% of the world aren't computer geeks. They have
> never and will never have to take the side off of an IBM Chess Champion
> and fix it. They will never have to look through the 12 volumes of AIX
> commands and, with all respect, would not own a computer if they were the
> criteria for owning one.[/color]

Yep, lets hope one laptop per child, running Linux will change Microsoft.
And most in China or India are not going to buy the hrse power to run Vista.
They can't afford it.

And when the next Chinese or Indian appliance comes in, don't be surprised
if the Windows server counts take a hit.
[color=blue]
> Whether you are the guy working on the 3D 'see it from all angles on the
> screen' 747 wiring loom, administrator for a few Storage Managers, home
> geek running two Linux variants just to type out something in OO Writer,
> or Grandma downloading pictures of her grandchildren via Yahoo Messenger,
> the common factor is computer user. One computer type doesn't do all. One
> OS doesn't do all.[/color]

I can write a document in OO Writer, and can view edit on almost any GUI
type platform, including Macs, Solaris, HP-UX, AIX, any BSD, any Linux with
a GUI. Your point? Why should I limit myself to Microsoft?
[color=blue]
> Re Vista, it works surprisingly well for many people. Like all other
> OS'es, it has had its issues but they are fast disappearing, just as they
> did for XP. Many users of Vista would never even come across Vista issues
> because they are not the type to delve into Windows Explorer or try to
> copy 5gb zipped files across a network. For those who do, some of the
> issues have already been addressed.[/color]

If you are limiting yourself to email, surfing and light document
processing, you are correct. Vista is "good enough". But I don't see end
users writing code and systems. Maybe that is why after billions spent in
FUD, Apache still outranks IIS.
[color=blue]
> The SP1 update was mistakenly made available for all instead of just for
> the TechNet/MSDN crowd, which is why it was pulled. The stuff that SP1
> broke had all received fixes fairly quickly, so it doesn't break them
> anymore.[/color]

That was a jab. I understand all fixes are not perfect - in any OS.
[color=blue]
> Is Vista right for everybody? If you know anything about computers, you
> will recognize that there is not an OS on the planet that is right for
> everybody, so knocking Vista, XP, Ubuntu, Suse, Fedora, Mac OS, AIX, is a
> dumb thing to do.[/color]

That is why I actually try them ALL, and get at least fairly good at it. It
was time for me to try Vista.
[color=blue]
> They all do what they do. You are happy with what you have now, so leave
> it at that. If Vista or any MS product doesn't work for you, use something
> else.[/color]

Happy now. Still have to decide if I like SUSE or Fedora better.

BTW - Would do your career good to diversify. Being a Microsoft Borg, you
must understand resistance in NOT futile, I/T organizations like
diversification.... sadly lacking in most MSCEs.

"NoStop" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:frdvdc0adl@news5.newsguy.com...[color=blue]
> Mike Hall - MVP wrote:
>[color=green]
>> "Canuck57" <dave-no_spam@unixhome.net> wrote in message
>> news:xWlCj.86587$pM4.68560@pd7urf1no...[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "Mike Hall - MVP" <mikehall@mvps.com> wrote in message
>>> news:eQ9y34RhIHA.4140@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>> Inline
>>>>
>>>> "Canuck57" <dave-no_spam@unixhome.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:YPaCj.84405$w94.7514@pd7urf2no...
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Mike,
>>>>>
>>>>> I too have tried Vista 64 bit and 32 bit and had the exact same
>>>>> frustrations. I too will not go into a list as it is too long to post
>>>>> here.
>>>>
>>>> Vista did have issues of its own, and have been addressed in the SP1
>>>> update which will find its way onto systems very soon.
>>>>
>>>> But Microsoft is not the whole industry, and for whatever reasons, many
>>>> 3rd party manufacturers and software authors showed public
>>>> intransigence
>>>> when it came to writing drivers or updates for anything. Even the MS
>>>> keyboard/mice manufacturer played hard to get.
>>>>
>>>> Some of the manufacturers have back tracked since the early days as
>>>> there was no big rush to replace printers, scanners, USB wireless
>>>> devices etc. What the manufacturers didn't want was for people to stay
>>>> with XP, because then there would be no need for users to replace
>>>> anything and they would lose revenue.
>>>>
>>>> 64bit is still much of a niche, and manufacturers were not prepared to
>>>> put time and effort into writing 64bit stuff if hardly anybody was
>>>> going
>>>> to use it. This is changing but slowly.
>>>>
>>>>> One advantage 64 bit has, is with the OS taking 22% of 8GB of RAM you
>>>>> have more free RAM for applications. And yes, I bought a nice GPU to
>>>>> replace on > onboard UMA.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> For the average user/business workstation there is not a need for more
>>>> than 4gb as yet. And integrated video is always a compromise as laptop
>>>> owners find out.
>>>>
>>>>> Vista looks nice, but peal off the fancy glass interface and it is a
>>>>> pest to use and customize. Slow on disk copy and network.
>>>>
>>>> SP1 addresses these issues
>>>
>>> SP1, was it not withdrawn once? Not a comforting feeling. And from
>>> what
>>> I hear, it does break new things.
>>>
>>>>> Obficated inside, try getting it working with Samba...
>>>>
>>>> Samba has issues too..
>>>
>>> The issue with Samba is Vista. I have used Samba for over 10 years.
>>> This is the first MS product it does not work with, and obviously
>>> deliberate on
>>> MS part. Samba even works with Linux, did you know that?
>>>
>>> And it's VPN/IPSec works too. Even between different version of Linux,
>>> Solaris and devices.
>>>
>>>> >Even though I am using it, and power savings off I can hear drives
>>>> >cycling
>>>> up and down.
>>>>
>>>> Vista defaults to power saving. It can be changed..
>>>
>>> I changed it. I was running Windows 1.0, that did not take long to
>>> figure, yet with sleep/conservation off the drives still would cycle.
>>> If
>>> have problems with it, my guess is very many people do, just haven't
>>> burned their drives out yet. But not a problems as of an hour ago.
>>>
>>>>>This is beta ware!
>>>>
>>>> No more than anything else in the IT world..
>>>
>>> Yes, but this accelerates the decline. Just that you and MS pundits
>>> have
>>> accepted it. If Vista was a car, I would be pursuing the lemon law.
>>>
>>>>> Why does Microsoft not sell or give us the option of which OS at a
>>>>> reasonable price? Seriously?
>>>>
>>>> Fixed overheads, salaries to be paid? They do more than produce Vista..
>>>
>>> Huh? XP is sunk cost. Not that much cost to keep it in copy. If I
>>> went
>>> to Ford, and said I wanted a F150 4x4, I don't think they would say they
>>> could only sell me an Edsel.
>>>
>>>>> Something wrong with "Shall that be Vista or XP?" on it's first boot?
>>>>> Is Microsoft grown so arrogant they want to force feed us Vista?
>>>>
>>>> Like many other software authors, they do not want to have to support
>>>> old stuff for ever..
>>>
>>> And we don't want to be the beta testers. Maybe Microsoft aught to make
>>> all their programers use machines people regularily buy, make them use
>>> Vista day in an day out until they get it right. And audit them to make
>>> sure they are not cheating.
>>>
>>>>> Don't tell me if I buy a small disk over priced business system so I
>>>>> can
>>>>> use XP, I want it on the $1000 home PC. I can't get XP Pro x64 or
>>>>> better yet MCE... I can get 32 bit, but that is insufficient. My
>>>>> other
>>>>> older PC is MCE and to me it is Microsoft's zenith in OS development.
>>>>> I want that one.
>>>>
>>>> Vista Ultimate replaces that..
>>>
>>> Bu11sh1t. I am not spending any more on Vista and at the rate of
>>> progress, I will likely retire before I see a SP 4. Ultimate, a chance
>>> to bilk people.
>>>
>>> MS profits are up for the moment because they are double dipping the
>>> consumer. Something that will not last. Buy a new machine, Vista only.
>>> Then get a XP so things will work. MS-Windows, bought twice runs once.
>>>
>>>>> I want XP MCE or I will switch to Linux.
>>>>
>>>> And you think that Linux will be better? Go ahead..
>>>
>>> Already did. Dual booting Fedora 8 and SUSE Enterprise to see which one
>>> I
>>> like best. No hassles either, the boot nicely coexists and isn't myopic
>>> like the MS one. Installed right the first time. Even downloaded
>>> MythTV
>>> for when I get the chance to play.
>>>
>>> Me, I now run real windows, X-Windows. Stable, compatible and proven.
>>> Even runs Office, OpenOffice that is.
>>>[/color]
>>
>>
>> Real Windows? hahahaha. I am amazed that you need any kind of Windows
>> being as you are into real computing.
>>
>> Tell me something. Does a document typed out in OO Writer carry more
>> weight than the same typed out in Word 2007? Do you need more technical
>> prowess to be able to do it?
>>
>> You anti-MS (or, I suspect anti any large corporation) Linux zealots talk
>> the same type of crap as did supporters of DOS when Windows first
>> appeared. Apparently, these people were into real computing, meaning that
>> one had to be able to remember at least five command line statements to
>> get through a day.
>>
>> Have you amazed your family by opening up a command window and typing in
>> 'ipconfig /all'. Weren't they just so impressed with your skill as all of
>> the text flashed up onto the screen!!
>>[/color]
> <snip much bs>
>
> ipconfig /all
> bash: ipconfig: command not found
>
> :-) Try again.
>
> Cheers.[/color]

Yep we configured IPs, not interfaces in MS-Windows.

ifconfig -a

Works on almost any OS other there except one company. Where you configure
interfaces with IPs.

"NoStop" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:frdvdc0adl@news5.newsguy.com...[color=blue]
> Mike Hall - MVP wrote:
>[color=green]
>> "Canuck57" <dave-no_spam@unixhome.net> wrote in message
>> news:xWlCj.86587$pM4.68560@pd7urf1no...[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "Mike Hall - MVP" <mikehall@mvps.com> wrote in message
>>> news:eQ9y34RhIHA.4140@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>> Inline
>>>>
>>>> "Canuck57" <dave-no_spam@unixhome.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:YPaCj.84405$w94.7514@pd7urf2no...
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Mike,
>>>>>
>>>>> I too have tried Vista 64 bit and 32 bit and had the exact same
>>>>> frustrations. I too will not go into a list as it is too long to post
>>>>> here.
>>>>
>>>> Vista did have issues of its own, and have been addressed in the SP1
>>>> update which will find its way onto systems very soon.
>>>>
>>>> But Microsoft is not the whole industry, and for whatever reasons, many
>>>> 3rd party manufacturers and software authors showed public
>>>> intransigence
>>>> when it came to writing drivers or updates for anything. Even the MS
>>>> keyboard/mice manufacturer played hard to get.
>>>>
>>>> Some of the manufacturers have back tracked since the early days as
>>>> there was no big rush to replace printers, scanners, USB wireless
>>>> devices etc. What the manufacturers didn't want was for people to stay
>>>> with XP, because then there would be no need for users to replace
>>>> anything and they would lose revenue.
>>>>
>>>> 64bit is still much of a niche, and manufacturers were not prepared to
>>>> put time and effort into writing 64bit stuff if hardly anybody was
>>>> going
>>>> to use it. This is changing but slowly.
>>>>
>>>>> One advantage 64 bit has, is with the OS taking 22% of 8GB of RAM you
>>>>> have more free RAM for applications. And yes, I bought a nice GPU to
>>>>> replace on > onboard UMA.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> For the average user/business workstation there is not a need for more
>>>> than 4gb as yet. And integrated video is always a compromise as laptop
>>>> owners find out.
>>>>
>>>>> Vista looks nice, but peal off the fancy glass interface and it is a
>>>>> pest to use and customize. Slow on disk copy and network.
>>>>
>>>> SP1 addresses these issues
>>>
>>> SP1, was it not withdrawn once? Not a comforting feeling. And from
>>> what
>>> I hear, it does break new things.
>>>
>>>>> Obficated inside, try getting it working with Samba...
>>>>
>>>> Samba has issues too..
>>>
>>> The issue with Samba is Vista. I have used Samba for over 10 years.
>>> This is the first MS product it does not work with, and obviously
>>> deliberate on
>>> MS part. Samba even works with Linux, did you know that?
>>>
>>> And it's VPN/IPSec works too. Even between different version of Linux,
>>> Solaris and devices.
>>>
>>>> >Even though I am using it, and power savings off I can hear drives
>>>> >cycling
>>>> up and down.
>>>>
>>>> Vista defaults to power saving. It can be changed..
>>>
>>> I changed it. I was running Windows 1.0, that did not take long to
>>> figure, yet with sleep/conservation off the drives still would cycle.
>>> If
>>> have problems with it, my guess is very many people do, just haven't
>>> burned their drives out yet. But not a problems as of an hour ago.
>>>
>>>>>This is beta ware!
>>>>
>>>> No more than anything else in the IT world..
>>>
>>> Yes, but this accelerates the decline. Just that you and MS pundits
>>> have
>>> accepted it. If Vista was a car, I would be pursuing the lemon law.
>>>
>>>>> Why does Microsoft not sell or give us the option of which OS at a
>>>>> reasonable price? Seriously?
>>>>
>>>> Fixed overheads, salaries to be paid? They do more than produce Vista..
>>>
>>> Huh? XP is sunk cost. Not that much cost to keep it in copy. If I
>>> went
>>> to Ford, and said I wanted a F150 4x4, I don't think they would say they
>>> could only sell me an Edsel.
>>>
>>>>> Something wrong with "Shall that be Vista or XP?" on it's first boot?
>>>>> Is Microsoft grown so arrogant they want to force feed us Vista?
>>>>
>>>> Like many other software authors, they do not want to have to support
>>>> old stuff for ever..
>>>
>>> And we don't want to be the beta testers. Maybe Microsoft aught to make
>>> all their programers use machines people regularily buy, make them use
>>> Vista day in an day out until they get it right. And audit them to make
>>> sure they are not cheating.
>>>
>>>>> Don't tell me if I buy a small disk over priced business system so I
>>>>> can
>>>>> use XP, I want it on the $1000 home PC. I can't get XP Pro x64 or
>>>>> better yet MCE... I can get 32 bit, but that is insufficient. My
>>>>> other
>>>>> older PC is MCE and to me it is Microsoft's zenith in OS development.
>>>>> I want that one.
>>>>
>>>> Vista Ultimate replaces that..
>>>
>>> Bu11sh1t. I am not spending any more on Vista and at the rate of
>>> progress, I will likely retire before I see a SP 4. Ultimate, a chance
>>> to bilk people.
>>>
>>> MS profits are up for the moment because they are double dipping the
>>> consumer. Something that will not last. Buy a new machine, Vista only.
>>> Then get a XP so things will work. MS-Windows, bought twice runs once.
>>>
>>>>> I want XP MCE or I will switch to Linux.
>>>>
>>>> And you think that Linux will be better? Go ahead..
>>>
>>> Already did. Dual booting Fedora 8 and SUSE Enterprise to see which one
>>> I
>>> like best. No hassles either, the boot nicely coexists and isn't myopic
>>> like the MS one. Installed right the first time. Even downloaded
>>> MythTV
>>> for when I get the chance to play.
>>>
>>> Me, I now run real windows, X-Windows. Stable, compatible and proven.
>>> Even runs Office, OpenOffice that is.
>>>[/color]
>>
>>
>> Real Windows? hahahaha. I am amazed that you need any kind of Windows
>> being as you are into real computing.
>>
>> Tell me something. Does a document typed out in OO Writer carry more
>> weight than the same typed out in Word 2007? Do you need more technical
>> prowess to be able to do it?
>>
>> You anti-MS (or, I suspect anti any large corporation) Linux zealots talk
>> the same type of crap as did supporters of DOS when Windows first
>> appeared. Apparently, these people were into real computing, meaning that
>> one had to be able to remember at least five command line statements to
>> get through a day.
>>
>> Have you amazed your family by opening up a command window and typing in
>> 'ipconfig /all'. Weren't they just so impressed with your skill as all of
>> the text flashed up onto the screen!!
>>[/color]
> <snip much bs>
>
> ipconfig /all
> bash: ipconfig: command not found
>
> :-) Try again.
>
> Cheers.[/color]

Yep we configured IPs, not interfaces in MS-Windows.

ifconfig -a

Works on almost any OS other there except one company. Where you configure
interfaces with IPs.

brummyfan wrote:[color=blue]
> Vista is for people with very low IQ, say around -50.
>
>[/color]
Well, with you having a -75 IQ, I guess you don't qualify right?
Bummers, huh?
Frank