Follow up on UAC thread

Very informative thread. While I understand the logic for UAC, I have the
sneaking suspicion that it was designed to protect click-happy daredevils
from themselves. If you don't click on any offer in a pop-up window that
comes along, you'll be OK.

But with the emerging under-the-radar installers on the Web, I'm not so sure
anymore.

So the logic is based on writing to protected locations? And if a program
(or a .dll or other app helper?) can't write to those protected places, they
won't run? Period?

Second question: This business about UAC quieting down after a few days just
isn't happening for me.

Jimmy Brush wrote in the other thread:

"Whenever a non-compliant program opens a file in a protected location,
UAC first checks to see if there is a "modified" version of that file
inside of your user profile folder, and if so, opens the modified file
instead of the original, without the program realizing it.

This allows the program to function by making it THINK that it is
writing to a protected location, when in reality it is not."

When I first read this, I thought it meant that after UAC diverts a
program's attempts to write to protected locations, that diversion to a
modified version should happen automatically from then on. I've already told
UAC the program is OK by allowing the first write to my user profile folder,
so why won't the process look seamless the next time?

But it isn't happening with WinRAR, much to my annoyance every time I try to
create or open a zip file. Am I missing something, or is UAC supposed to
sound off every time a program is diverted from the protected to modified
location?

Thanks.

You can always create a shortcut to the program, right click
on the shortcut, and say "run as administrator". That should
solve your UAC problem for WinRAR.

-- Larry Maturo


"hogyu" <moneyko******.com> wrote in message
news:O$iboRGrHHA.3380@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...[color=blue]
> Very informative thread. While I understand the logic for UAC, I have the
> sneaking suspicion that it was designed to protect click-happy daredevils
> from themselves. If you don't click on any offer in a pop-up window that
> comes along, you'll be OK.
>
> But with the emerging under-the-radar installers on the Web, I'm not so
> sure anymore.
>
> So the logic is based on writing to protected locations? And if a program
> (or a .dll or other app helper?) can't write to those protected places,
> they won't run? Period?
>
> Second question: This business about UAC quieting down after a few days
> just isn't happening for me.
>
> Jimmy Brush wrote in the other thread:
>
> "Whenever a non-compliant program opens a file in a protected location,
> UAC first checks to see if there is a "modified" version of that file
> inside of your user profile folder, and if so, opens the modified file
> instead of the original, without the program realizing it.
>
> This allows the program to function by making it THINK that it is
> writing to a protected location, when in reality it is not."
>
> When I first read this, I thought it meant that after UAC diverts a
> program's attempts to write to protected locations, that diversion to a
> modified version should happen automatically from then on. I've already
> told UAC the program is OK by allowing the first write to my user profile
> folder, so why won't the process look seamless the next time?
>
> But it isn't happening with WinRAR, much to my annoyance every time I try
> to create or open a zip file. Am I missing something, or is UAC supposed
> to sound off every time a program is diverted from the protected to
> modified location?
>
> Thanks.[/color]

Larry

This will not help, because the program must still get the users permission,
even if the run as administrator is enabled. The only thing this option does
is to make sure that the program asks permission and does run with admin
privileges.



--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


"Larry Maturo" <lmaturo@imceda.com> wrote in message
news:uJo1F1GrHHA.1200@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...[color=blue]
> You can always create a shortcut to the program, right click
> on the shortcut, and say "run as administrator". That should
> solve your UAC problem for WinRAR.
>
> -- Larry Maturo
>
>
> "hogyu" <moneyko******.com> wrote in message
> news:O$iboRGrHHA.3380@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...[color=green]
>> Very informative thread. While I understand the logic for UAC, I have the
>> sneaking suspicion that it was designed to protect click-happy daredevils
>> from themselves. If you don't click on any offer in a pop-up window that
>> comes along, you'll be OK.
>>
>> But with the emerging under-the-radar installers on the Web, I'm not so
>> sure anymore.
>>
>> So the logic is based on writing to protected locations? And if a program
>> (or a .dll or other app helper?) can't write to those protected places,
>> they won't run? Period?
>>
>> Second question: This business about UAC quieting down after a few days
>> just isn't happening for me.
>>
>> Jimmy Brush wrote in the other thread:
>>
>> "Whenever a non-compliant program opens a file in a protected location,
>> UAC first checks to see if there is a "modified" version of that file
>> inside of your user profile folder, and if so, opens the modified file
>> instead of the original, without the program realizing it.
>>
>> This allows the program to function by making it THINK that it is
>> writing to a protected location, when in reality it is not."
>>
>> When I first read this, I thought it meant that after UAC diverts a
>> program's attempts to write to protected locations, that diversion to a
>> modified version should happen automatically from then on. I've already
>> told UAC the program is OK by allowing the first write to my user profile
>> folder, so why won't the process look seamless the next time?
>>
>> But it isn't happening with WinRAR, much to my annoyance every time I try
>> to create or open a zip file. Am I missing something, or is UAC supposed
>> to sound off every time a program is diverted from the protected to
>> modified location?
>>
>> Thanks.[/color]
>
>[/color]

"hogyu" <moneyko******.com> wrote in message
news:O$iboRGrHHA.3380@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
<snip>
[color=blue]
> So the logic is based on writing to protected locations? And if a program
> (or a .dll or other app helper?) can't write to those protected places,
> they won't run? Period?[/color]

Correct, when a program needs to write to a protected location, the program
must ask the user for permission with a UAC prompt. If the program does not
ask permission, then it will silently fail.
[color=blue]
> Second question: This business about UAC quieting down after a few days
> just isn't happening for me.[/color]

This behavior is based on the fact that when you are first configuring the
computer with Vista, you are performing a lot of software installations,
which means a lot of UAC prompts. Once the system is configured properly,
you should not see as many UAC prompts. However, one thing that can effect
this behavior is if you install a lot of incompatible programs that have not
been updated to work properly with UAC. After a Vista compatible program is
installed, you should never see another UAC prompt from that program. There
are a few exceptions to this rule, such as system utilities that require
system wide access when they run.
[color=blue]
> When I first read this, I thought it meant that after UAC diverts a
> program's attempts to write to protected locations, that diversion to a
> modified version should happen automatically from then on. I've already
> told UAC the program is OK by allowing the first write to my user profile
> folder, so why won't the process look seamless the next time?[/color]

If you think about this, if a program could be marked as OK to run by UAC,
then any malicious program could attach itself to that program or spoof that
program and gain unlimited access to the system. This is what made XP so
weak in the area of security, with everyone running with full administrator
privileges, many without even a password.
[color=blue]
> But it isn't happening with WinRAR, much to my annoyance every time I try
> to create or open a zip file. Am I missing something, or is UAC supposed
> to sound off every time a program is diverted from the protected to
> modified location?[/color]

Have you checked the WinRAR website for the latest, Vista compatible
version? The program could be doing other things like accessing the
protected areas of the Registry for configuration information each time it
runs.

Hope this helps.
--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User