Stephen. I am just making a point. So many Linux enthusiasts come here and
say that the cure for everyone's ills is to use Linux.

Well, I for one, am not going to dump thousands of dollars of programs and
"hope" I can find a CAD program that the people I do contract work for will
accept.

When they say they want CAD drawings - they specifically mean AutoCAD
drawings.

So yes Stephen, I am just "tweaking" their noses a bit.

Personally, after using Red Hat and 3-4 different versions of Ubuntu I look
at any of them as a silly diversion. Sorry if you can't accept that I have
no use for it. Really, I am.

--


Regards,

Richard Urban
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User
(For email, remove the obvious from my address)

Quote from George Ankner:
If you knew as much as you think you know,
You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!

"Stephan Rose" <kermos@nospam.somrek.net> wrote in message
news:C7Gdnau6bN71MLbbnZ2dnUVZ8qKvnZ2d@giganews.com...[color=blue]
> Richard Urban wrote:
>[color=green]
>> I spent about 45 minutes this morning loading Ubunto 7.04 on my computer.
>> I can't do **anything** with it.
>>
>> As Ubuntu loads by default:
>>
>> I can't load/run Office 2007
>>
>> I can't load/run AutoCAD, any version
>>
>> I can't load/run Visio 2007
>>
>> I can't do *****ANYTHING***** that I can do in Windows 2000, Windows XP
>> or
>> Vista.
>>
>> What good is Linsux?[/color]
>
> With all due respect Richard, you are expecting Windows apps to run on a
> non-windows operating system.
>
> I honestly do not get why people expect Linux to run Windows apps. Windows
> cant run Linux apps either. Linux apps that have their source code ported
> to Windows don't count here, I mean native linux apps.
>
> It's like buying a diesel and expecting it to run on friggin gasoline!
>
> They are different operating systems. They do things differently. They use
> different apps. It should be this way. If they were identical, what would
> be the point?
>
> If you try linux expecting all your windows apps to run then you are bound
> for failure as this is impossible. Same would be possible vice-versa as
> not
> everthing from the linux world is ported to windows.
>
> While WINE does exist for running windows apps under linux, it is far from
> being able to run everything and I honestly doubt it will ever get there.
>
> The whole "windows apps under linux" is completely the wrong approach.
> What
> is needed are the approriate replacement apps under linux so that the
> windows equivalents are no longer needed. In some cases these exist. In
> some cases they don't. In some cases they are better than the windows
> equivalent. In some cases they are not.
>
> Everything has its pros / cons somewhere. No single OS is ever going to
> please everyone.
>
> People who do not wish to use a different app because it has a different
> name but otherwise the same functionality just need to stick to windows.
> Nothing will help there.
>
>
>[color=green]
>>
>> And don't tell me there are substitutes that run in Linsux. I want the
>> above three programs to run on Linsux as Linsux installs by default.[/color]
>
> In that case your only choice is windows. No non-windows os in the world
> is
> ever going to fully, if at all, support windows applications.
>[color=green]
>>
>> No wonder Linsux is years away from being a desktop replacement. All it
>> is good for is surfing the web and getting email. (-:[/color]
>
> So basically it is perfectly fine and capable for...the majority of the
> population of this planet who pretty much don't do much else beyond that?
>
> I find that the only thing that I have to boot into windows for is the
> occasional gaming. Everything else I can do right here from Ubuntu and my
> needs go far beyond surfing the web and getting e-mail. Matter of fact, I
> am about to go watch a DVD on my attached Plasma TV which I currently
> CANNOT under windows since nVidia dropped full screen video overlay on my
> current drivers!! yay!!! Go windows! Now before you go blaming the vendor,
> interestingly enough...the same vendors linux drivers have far more
> features and options than the windows drivers have ever had...
>
> --
> Stephan
> 2003 Yamaha R6
>
> 君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
> 君のこと忘れたときがないから[/color]

Wow! I didn't realize that I have been ***TRANSITIONING*** for so long!

--


Regards,

Richard Urban
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User
(For email, remove the obvious from my address)

Quote from George Ankner:
If you knew as much as you think you know,
You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!

"Richard Urban" <richardurbanREMOVETHIS********.com> wrote in message
news:%23WWzH%23QhHHA.4704@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...[color=blue]
>
>
> What is the date/time in the Ubuntu 7.04 window?
>
> What is that over there on the left? Is that Ubuntu 6.06.1 I see?
>
> And OMFG! That's Ubuntu 6.10 too? WOW!
>
> Ubuntu, and all Linux, is still crap!
>
> --
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Richard Urban
> Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User
> (For email, remove the obvious from my address)
>
> Quote from George Ankner:
> If you knew as much as you think you know,
> You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!
>[/color]

On Sun, 22 Apr 2007 12:56:28 -0400, Richard Urban wrote:
[color=blue]
> I spent about 45 minutes this morning loading Ubunto 7.04 on my computer. I
> can't do **anything** with it.
>
> As Ubuntu loads by default:
>
> I can't load/run Office 2007[/color]

You certainly can, via WINE. But there is no need to: OpenOffice is
included.
[color=blue]
>
> I can't load/run AutoCAD, any version[/color]

Probably you can, via WINE. But there is no need to: there are several
good native Linux CAD programs.
[color=blue]
>
> I can't load/run Visio 2007
>
> I can't do *****ANYTHING***** that I can do in Windows 2000, Windows XP or
> Vista.
>
> What good is Linsux?
>
> And don't tell me there are substitutes that run in Linsux. I want the above
> three programs to run on Linsux as Linsux installs by default.[/color]

Then install WINE, and do it.

[color=blue]
>
> No wonder Linsux is years away from being a desktop replacement. All it is
> good for is surfing the web and getting email. (-:[/color]

Linux is not designed to be another MS version - it is designed to be a
stable reliable OS, and it is. It has native apps available that do 99% of
what folks need to do.

Why dump thousands of dollars of programs that I have purchased to use a
free operating system. That is not cost effective.

--


Regards,

Richard Urban
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User
(For email, remove the obvious from my address)

Quote from George Ankner:
If you knew as much as you think you know,
You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!

"ray" <ray@zianet.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2007.04.22.19.38.13.582253@zianet.com...[color=blue]
> On Sun, 22 Apr 2007 12:56:28 -0400, Richard Urban wrote:
>[color=green]
>> I spent about 45 minutes this morning loading Ubunto 7.04 on my computer.
>> I
>> can't do **anything** with it.
>>
>> As Ubuntu loads by default:
>>
>> I can't load/run Office 2007[/color]
>
> You certainly can, via WINE. But there is no need to: OpenOffice is
> included.
>[color=green]
>>
>> I can't load/run AutoCAD, any version[/color]
>
> Probably you can, via WINE. But there is no need to: there are several
> good native Linux CAD programs.
>[color=green]
>>
>> I can't load/run Visio 2007
>>
>> I can't do *****ANYTHING***** that I can do in Windows 2000, Windows XP
>> or
>> Vista.
>>
>> What good is Linsux?
>>
>> And don't tell me there are substitutes that run in Linsux. I want the
>> above
>> three programs to run on Linsux as Linsux installs by default.[/color]
>
> Then install WINE, and do it.
>
>[color=green]
>>
>> No wonder Linsux is years away from being a desktop replacement. All it
>> is
>> good for is surfing the web and getting email. (-:[/color]
>
> Linux is not designed to be another MS version - it is designed to be a
> stable reliable OS, and it is. It has native apps available that do 99% of
> what folks need to do.
>[/color]

Mike Hall - MS MVP wrote:[color=blue]
> Why go there and not the official Ubuntu forum?[/color]

Not an either/or thing. Both are good.

Alias[color=blue]
>
> "Alias" <aka@masked&anonymous.bg> wrote in message
> news:f0g5kj$dii$1@aioe.org...[color=green]
>> Richard Urban wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> No! I am not going to munge the operating system. Just as you have
>>> said in the past - it should just work! If Ubuntu 7.04, and other
>>> flavors of Linux can't run what I need "out of the box" (so to say),
>>> WTF good is it.
>>>
>>> I had hoped that Manical had come along further than they did.
>>>
>>> If these other things that you have talked of in the past are
>>> available, and allow one to load Window programs, why isn't it
>>> included, turned on and configured to do so **BY DEFAULT**.
>>>
>>> Then they may have something.
>>>
>>> As it stands now it is a somewhat relaxing diversion.[/color]
>>
>> Try asking on alt.os.linux.ubuntu or don't you have the balls?
>>
>> Alias[/color]
>[/color]

Richard Urban wrote:
[color=blue]
> Stephen. I am just making a point. So many Linux enthusiasts come here and
> say that the cure for everyone's ills is to use Linux.[/color]

Ahh allright, gotcha. As much as I enjoy using Ubuntu even I would not go as
far as saying it is the cure for everyone's ills. I find it great in many
respects, but I can admit without a problem that it has a few flaws too
though.
[color=blue]
>
> Well, I for one, am not going to dump thousands of dollars of programs and
> "hope" I can find a CAD program that the people I do contract work for
> will accept.
>
> When they say they want CAD drawings - they specifically mean AutoCAD
> drawings.[/color]

Believe me, I know that boat all that well. I am sitting in it right beside
you. For you it is AutoCAD, for me it is Inventor.

My only potential alternatives for linux are ProE or UGS.

That list gets shortened to ProE as UGS wants over 2 grand for a 40 hour one
week course on how to use their software before they are willing to give me
a trial version to see if I even WANT their software!

But likely, I will stay with Inventor as talking to ProE has not been among
the easiest things either. So besides gaming, Inventor is the one other
thing that makes me have to keep windows around.
[color=blue]
>
> So yes Stephen, I am just "tweaking" their noses a bit.[/color]

Fair enough. =)
[color=blue]
>
> Personally, after using Red Hat and 3-4 different versions of Ubuntu I
> look at any of them as a silly diversion. Sorry if you can't accept that I
> have no use for it. Really, I am.[/color]

I can personally accept it just fine. I mean it honestly does not matter to
me what you use. We all have to decide for ourselves whats right / wrong.

I actually looked forward to the release of Vista. I mean I was a major MS
supporter for many years. I develop software for their OS after all! I just
do not like the direction MS is headed with Vista. I honestly was sorely
dissapointed.

--
Stephan
2003 Yamaha R6

君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
君のこと忘れたときがないから

Mike Hall - MS MVP wrote:[color=blue]
> Too funny..[/color]

Feeling smug and superior again, Mike?

Alias[color=blue]
>
>
> "Alias" <aka@masked&anonymous.bg> wrote in message
> news:f0g6c5$fuf$1@aioe.org...[color=green]
>> Mike Hall - MS MVP wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> Alias
>>>
>>> Had you done research, your transition period would have long been
>>> over.. lol..[/color]
>>
>> And the reason you think I am in a hurry is?
>>
>> Alias[color=darkred]
>>>
>>>
>>> "Alias" <aka@masked&anonymous.bg> wrote in message
>>> news:f0g4m6$9u4$3@aioe.org...
>>>> Richard Urban wrote:
>>>>> I spent about 45 minutes this morning loading Ubunto 7.04 on my
>>>>> computer. I can't do **anything** with it.
>>>>>
>>>>> As Ubuntu loads by default:
>>>>>
>>>>> I can't load/run Office 2007
>>>>
>>>> A plus, although there are ways to run that bloatware in Linux. Do
>>>> your research or ask on an appropriate newsgroup or IRC group.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I can't load/run AutoCAD, any version
>>>>
>>>> Maybe you need to do more research.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I can't load/run Visio 2007
>>>>
>>>> Maybe you need to do more research.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I can't do *****ANYTHING***** that I can do in Windows 2000,
>>>>> Windows XP or Vista.
>>>>>
>>>>> What good is Linsux?
>>>>>
>>>>> And don't tell me there are substitutes that run in Linsux. I want
>>>>> the above three programs to run on Linsux as Linsux installs by
>>>>> default.
>>>>
>>>> Try asking on a Linux newsgroup or IRC group.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> No wonder Linsux is years away from being a desktop replacement.
>>>>> All it is good for is surfing the web and getting email. (-:
>>>>
>>>> False but you know that, don't you? Or do you?
>>>>
>>>> Alias
>>>[/color][/color]
>[/color]

Richard Urban wrote:[color=blue]
> Two months ago you were telling us how you were using Ubuntu. It takes
> you that long to learn a new operating system.
>
> It's free man. That means NO MONEY. There is no reason in the friggin
> world that you should not have it on your other two computers and be
> done with it.
>
> It is so easy, as you have said. JUST DO IT, AND QUIT TALKING ABOUT IT.
>
> Oh! The wife and kiddies can't use Linux. Well, it's so easy - teach
> them tonight.
>
> After all, you have 2 months experience under your belt and should be an
> expert. Wait! You're not an expert under Windows - why should you be an
> expert under Ubuntu?
>[/color]


Feeling smug and superior again, Dick?

Alias

Richard Urban wrote:[color=blue]
> Wow! I didn't realize that I have been ***TRANSITIONING*** for so long!
>[/color]

Please show me a quote where I state I am a computer expert. Until the
meantime, wear your smugness and sense of superiority any way you like.

Alias

Mike Hall - MS MVP wrote:[color=blue]
> Stephan
>
> I do hope that Alias is taking notes from what you say.. he is still in
> a transitory state, ya know.. :-)[/color]

I certainly learn more about Ubuntu reading Stephen than I do about
Windows reading you.

Alias[color=blue]
>
>
> "Stephan Rose" <kermos@nospam.somrek.net> wrote in message
> news:C7Gdnau6bN71MLbbnZ2dnUVZ8qKvnZ2d@giganews.com...[color=green]
>> Richard Urban wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>> I spent about 45 minutes this morning loading Ubunto 7.04 on my
>>> computer.
>>> I can't do **anything** with it.
>>>
>>> As Ubuntu loads by default:
>>>
>>> I can't load/run Office 2007
>>>
>>> I can't load/run AutoCAD, any version
>>>
>>> I can't load/run Visio 2007
>>>
>>> I can't do *****ANYTHING***** that I can do in Windows 2000, Windows
>>> XP or
>>> Vista.
>>>
>>> What good is Linsux?[/color]
>>
>> With all due respect Richard, you are expecting Windows apps to run on a
>> non-windows operating system.
>>
>> I honestly do not get why people expect Linux to run Windows apps.
>> Windows
>> cant run Linux apps either. Linux apps that have their source code ported
>> to Windows don't count here, I mean native linux apps.
>>
>> It's like buying a diesel and expecting it to run on friggin gasoline!
>>
>> They are different operating systems. They do things differently. They
>> use
>> different apps. It should be this way. If they were identical, what would
>> be the point?
>>
>> If you try linux expecting all your windows apps to run then you are
>> bound
>> for failure as this is impossible. Same would be possible vice-versa
>> as not
>> everthing from the linux world is ported to windows.
>>
>> While WINE does exist for running windows apps under linux, it is far
>> from
>> being able to run everything and I honestly doubt it will ever get there.
>>
>> The whole "windows apps under linux" is completely the wrong approach.
>> What
>> is needed are the approriate replacement apps under linux so that the
>> windows equivalents are no longer needed. In some cases these exist. In
>> some cases they don't. In some cases they are better than the windows
>> equivalent. In some cases they are not.
>>
>> Everything has its pros / cons somewhere. No single OS is ever going to
>> please everyone.
>>
>> People who do not wish to use a different app because it has a different
>> name but otherwise the same functionality just need to stick to windows.
>> Nothing will help there.
>>
>>
>>[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> And don't tell me there are substitutes that run in Linsux. I want the
>>> above three programs to run on Linsux as Linsux installs by default.[/color]
>>
>> In that case your only choice is windows. No non-windows os in the
>> world is
>> ever going to fully, if at all, support windows applications.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> No wonder Linsux is years away from being a desktop replacement. All it
>>> is good for is surfing the web and getting email. (-:[/color]
>>
>> So basically it is perfectly fine and capable for...the majority of the
>> population of this planet who pretty much don't do much else beyond that?
>>
>> I find that the only thing that I have to boot into windows for is the
>> occasional gaming. Everything else I can do right here from Ubuntu and my
>> needs go far beyond surfing the web and getting e-mail. Matter of fact, I
>> am about to go watch a DVD on my attached Plasma TV which I currently
>> CANNOT under windows since nVidia dropped full screen video overlay on my
>> current drivers!! yay!!! Go windows! Now before you go blaming the
>> vendor,
>> interestingly enough...the same vendors linux drivers have far more
>> features and options than the windows drivers have ever had...
>>
>> --
>> Stephan
>> 2003 Yamaha R6
>>
>> 君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
>> 君のこと忘れたときがないから[/color]
>[/color]

Richard Urban wrote:[color=blue]
> Why dump thousands of dollars of programs that I have purchased to use a
> free operating system. That is not cost effective.
>[/color]

Don't. Please. Stay with Windows. What gives you the idea anyone cares
whether you take advantage of a real OS instead of Windows which is in
its last throes before disappearing into the sunset?

Alias

"Alias" <aka@masked&anonymous.bg> wrote in message
news:f0geh0$6l1$6@aioe.org...[color=blue]
> Richard Urban wrote:[color=green]
>> Why dump thousands of dollars of programs that I have purchased to use a
>> free operating system. That is not cost effective.
>>[/color]
>
> Don't. Please. Stay with Windows. What gives you the idea anyone cares
> whether you take advantage of a real OS instead of Windows which is in its
> last throes before disappearing into the sunset?[/color]

so if linux is soooo friggin good...why are you posting your inane drivell
like some irksome piss stain?
--
Scotty©

Scotty© wrote:[color=blue]
>
> "Alias" <aka@masked&anonymous.bg> wrote in message
> news:f0geh0$6l1$6@aioe.org...[color=green]
>> Richard Urban wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> Why dump thousands of dollars of programs that I have purchased to
>>> use a free operating system. That is not cost effective.
>>>[/color]
>>
>> Don't. Please. Stay with Windows. What gives you the idea anyone cares
>> whether you take advantage of a real OS instead of Windows which is in
>> its last throes before disappearing into the sunset?[/color]
>
> so if linux is soooo friggin good...why are you posting your inane
> drivell like some irksome piss stain?[/color]

If you have self control, don't read my posts. If you don't have self
control, filter my posts out.

Alias

"Stephan Rose" <kermos@nospam.somrek.net> wrote in message
news:N-WdnTa1H_EGJrbbRVnyiAA@giganews.com...[color=blue]
> Richard Urban wrote:
>[color=green]
>> Stephen. I am just making a point. So many Linux enthusiasts come here
>> and
>> say that the cure for everyone's ills is to use Linux.[/color]
>
> Ahh allright, gotcha. As much as I enjoy using Ubuntu even I would not go
> as
> far as saying it is the cure for everyone's ills. I find it great in many
> respects, but I can admit without a problem that it has a few flaws too
> though.
>[color=green]
>>
>> Well, I for one, am not going to dump thousands of dollars of programs
>> and
>> "hope" I can find a CAD program that the people I do contract work for
>> will accept.
>>
>> When they say they want CAD drawings - they specifically mean AutoCAD
>> drawings.[/color]
>
> Believe me, I know that boat all that well. I am sitting in it right
> beside
> you. For you it is AutoCAD, for me it is Inventor.
>
> My only potential alternatives for linux are ProE or UGS.
>
> That list gets shortened to ProE as UGS wants over 2 grand for a 40 hour
> one
> week course on how to use their software before they are willing to give
> me
> a trial version to see if I even WANT their software!
>
> But likely, I will stay with Inventor as talking to ProE has not been
> among
> the easiest things either. So besides gaming, Inventor is the one other
> thing that makes me have to keep windows around.
>[color=green]
>>
>> So yes Stephen, I am just "tweaking" their noses a bit.[/color]
>
> Fair enough. =)
>[color=green]
>>
>> Personally, after using Red Hat and 3-4 different versions of Ubuntu I
>> look at any of them as a silly diversion. Sorry if you can't accept that
>> I
>> have no use for it. Really, I am.[/color]
>
> I can personally accept it just fine. I mean it honestly does not matter
> to
> me what you use. We all have to decide for ourselves whats right / wrong.
>
> I actually looked forward to the release of Vista. I mean I was a major MS
> supporter for many years. I develop software for their OS after all! I
> just
> do not like the direction MS is headed with Vista. I honestly was sorely
> dissapointed.
>
> --
> Stephan
> 2003 Yamaha R6
>
> 君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
> 君のこと忘れたときがないから[/color]


I can't say I am 100% enthralled with Vista. I doubt that anyone honestly
can. But it does what I want when I want it to. And, It installed fine on my
4-5 year old hardware "as is". I didn't have to spend a dime on hardware. Of
course, I had a system that was miles ahead of "marginal" when I was running
Windows XP.

And I am still going to futz around with the new version of Ubuntu. But
being alone I have no need for 2 operational computers. And, if my main
computer goes south my backup would need either XP or Vista on it anyway
(software investment).

--


Regards,

Richard Urban
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User
(For email, remove the obvious from my address)

Quote from George Ankner:
If you knew as much as you think you know,
You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!

You and I will disappear into the sunset before Microsoft/Windows will. (-:

--


Regards,

Richard Urban
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User
(For email, remove the obvious from my address)

Quote from George Ankner:
If you knew as much as you think you know,
You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!

"Alias" <aka@masked&anonymous.bg> wrote in message
news:f0geh0$6l1$6@aioe.org...[color=blue]
> Richard Urban wrote:[color=green]
>> Why dump thousands of dollars of programs that I have purchased to use a
>> free operating system. That is not cost effective.
>>[/color]
>
> Don't. Please. Stay with Windows. What gives you the idea anyone cares
> whether you take advantage of a real OS instead of Windows which is in its
> last throes before disappearing into the sunset?
>
> Alias[/color]