"Chad Harris" wrote:
[color=blue]
> Correction:
>
> Spelling:
>
>
> No Sam--you can't read something clearly written with sufficient
> comprehension. Try this. I'll do my best to me ake it clear. If it's
> not--don't be shy and sing out. I'll parse it more clearly in the area you
> don't understand. If English is not your first language, I'll get it
> translated. I aim to please you. I'm terribly honored by the condescending,
> dismissive tone of your question and glad to help. I also eagerly look
> forward to the large volume of help you plan to post here--someday.
>
> My premise has been this:
>
>
> MSFT is doing poorly at educating the public as to Vista, not to mention
> they haven't been able to fix major components like Device Manager since
> 1995. One of the major features of devmgmt.msc is to validate driver health
> and it doesn't. Google for the Beta driver chats.
>
> My points--and let me know if you need this made more clear or suscinct:
>
> 1) MSFT makes a disingenuous pomp and circumstance of encouraging customer
> feedback from the public. However they piss on that by not allowing Connect
> access to bugs. They make
> the Beta available as a sales adjunct to the campaigns by Wagner Edstrom and
> McCann Ericson Worldwide. They hide bugs because they want to promote sales
> of a product that is going to ship broken that they didn't fix.
>
> 2) 2) To maximize education they need to make Beta Chats available in one
> place
> on ther sites and in an MSKB the way they make milestone build fixes
> available in KBs you haven't seen.
>
> 3) To maximize education they need to make Beta Live Meetings available on
> their site.
>
> The reason I want these showcased and available is that they provide a lot
> of detail that answers questions people continue to ask.
>
> 4) This gives up nothing propiritiary and doesn't impact any vague lol
> "security for their beta" whatsoever that Tom Ziegler very nebulously
> alluded to saying MSFT had "their own reasons." It promotes education in
> the same way that MSFT's pilot high school that purports to use only laptops
> and no books in Pennsylvanania that is in the news this week does.
>
> 5) want the public to be much better users. I want them to have a much
> clearer understanding than they have of how to download RC1 and get product
> keys which seems the subject of endless obsession. I have seen people told
> repeatedly how to get RC1 and have done it myself and noticed that they post
> questions without doing a search on the group--they probably don't know it
> exists and are using the crappy web interface made by the MSFT communnity
> instead of OE or Win Mail. Many of the questions here are asked hundreds of
> times because people are to lazy to search the answers that most of us have
> answered hundreds of times who do the answering.
>
> I realize that many of the people who ask these questions are a little too
> lazy to navigate to the MSFT sites and read them, so it becomes all the more
> imperative to up the level of education.
>
> I also think that those of us who work on newsgroups to help explain
> features and fix Windows for MSFT's customers and sometimes evangelize their
> products are entitled to high qaulity Vista info. It isn't on MSFT's site
> on most of the major system features of Vista the way it was for XP at the
> stage between RC1 and RC2 during the late summer of 2001 before the Windows
> XP Launch on October 25, 2001.
> I also understand a very small percent of XP users on the planet used Help
> and Support in XP, and I hope they will take advantage of the new Help
> server for Vista as well as Guided Support's work in progress in Vista
> should they need it.
>
> If this is not clear to you, by all means ask me to parse it. I was born in
> California, so I don't know if my command of English is up to the usual
> sophisticated level you're accustomed to.
>
> I want to make it very clear.
>
> I also alluded to the fact that one of the major sales revenue streasms to
> customers of MSFT for Vista will be on pre-installed boxes. The major
> repair modality for a no boot Vista is Win RE--and it's cheif component is
> Startup Repair located on the setup screen at the lower left as "Recovery."
>
> The OEM purchasers will not have a Vista retail DVD due to a nasty policy
> conjointly promoted by MSFT and its 30OEM "name partners" big guys like
> Dell, HP, Sony who make among other things computers. . They will have
> recovery CDs and hidden and non-hidden partitions that *WILL NOT* reach Win
> RE. This is analagous to the same arrangement in Win XP where the recovery
> discs and partitions would not do a repair install which is the chief
> modality to fix a no boot XP after F8 Windows Advanced options fail.
>
> I have an additional challenge tailored just for Sam-R:
>
> You take what OEM sends you and choose any of your ten home boys and girls
> you think are superior Windows users. I'll take the retail XP CDs and DVDs.
> We''ll put up some substantial money and see who wins as to recovery with
> what we each have to use.
>
> You game? Bring it.
>
> [Please let me know if you can't comprehend the *points* that have been made
> here Sam-R. I aim to please you and will be glad to refine the
> clarification until you can comprehend it.]
>
> Best regards,
>
> CH
>
>
>
> "Chad Harris" <RC1needs6months@theywanturmoney.net> wrote in message
> news:...[color=green]
> > No Sam--you can't read something clearly written with sufficeint
> > comprehension. Try this. I'll do my best to m ake it clear. If it's
> > not--don't be shy and sing out. I'll parse it more clearly in the area
> > you don't understand. If English is not your first language, I'll get it
> > translated. I aim to please you. I'm terribly honored by the
> > condescending tone of your question and glad to help.
> >
> > My premise has been this:
> >
> >
> > MSFT is doing poorly at educating the public as to Vista, not to mention
> > they haven't been able to fix major components like Device Manager since
> > 1995. One of the major features of devmgmt.msc is to validate driver
> > health and it doesn't. Google for the Beta driver chats.
> >
> > My points--and let me know if you need this made more clear or suscinct:
> >
> > 1) MSFT makes a disingenuous pomp and circumstance of encouraging customer
> > feedback from the public.
> > However they piss on that by not allowing Connect access to bugs. They
> > make the Beta available as a sales adjunct to the campaings by Wagner
> > Edstrom and McCann Ericson Worldwide. They hide bugs because they want to
> > promote sales of a product that is going to ship broken that they didn't
> > fix.
> >
> >
> > 2) To maximize education they need to make Beta Chats available in one
> > place on ther sites and in an MSKB the way they make milestone build fixes
> > available in KBs you haven't seen.
> >
> > 3) To maximize education they need to make Beta Live Meetings available on
> > their site.
> >
> > This gives up nothing propiritiary and doesn't impact any vague lol
> > "security for their beta" whatsoever that Tom Ziegler very nebulously
> > alluded to saying MSFT had "their own reasons." It promotes education in
> > the same way that MSFT's pilot school in Pennsylvanania that is in the
> > news this week does.
> >
> > I want the public to be much better users. I want them to have a much
> > clearer u nderstanding than they have of how to download RC1 and get
> > product keys which seems the subject of endless obsession.
> >
> > I realize that many of the people who ask these questions are a little too
> > lazy to navigate to the MSFT sites and read them, so it becomes all the
> > more imperative to up the level of education.
> >
> > I also think that those of us who work on newsgroups to help explain
> > features and fix Windows for MSFT's customers and sometimes evangelize
> > their products are entitled to high qaulity Vista info. It isn't on
> > MSFT's site on most of the major system features of Vista the way it was
> > for XP at the stage between RC1 and RC2 during the late summer of 2005.
> >
> > If this is not clear to you, by all means ask me to parse it. I was born
> > in California, so I don't know if my command of English is up to the usual
> > sophisticated level you're accustomed to.
> >
> > I want to make it very clear.
> >
> > I also alluded to the fact that one of the major sales revenue streasms
> > to customers of MSFT for Vista will be on pre-installed boxes. The major
> > repair modality for a no boot Vista is Win RE--and it's cheif component is
> > Startup Repair located on the setup screen at the lower left as
> > "Recovery." The OEM purchasers will not have a Vista retail DVD due to a
> > nasty policy conjointly promoted by MSFT and its 30OEM "name partners"
> > big guys like Dell, HP, Sony who make among other things computers. .
> > They will have recovery CDs and hidden and non-hidden partitions that WILL
> > NOT reach Win RE. This is analagous to the same arrangement in Win XP
> > where the recovery discs and partitions would not do a repair install
> > which is the chief modality to fix a no boot XP after F8 Windows Advanced
> > options fail.
> >
> > I have an additional challenge for you:
> >
> > You take what OEM sends you and choose any of your ten home boys and girls
> > you think are superior Windows users. I'll take the retail XP CDs and
> > DVDs. We''ll put up some substantial money and see who wins as to recovery
> > with what we each have to use.
> >
> > You game? Bring it.
> >
> > CH
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "SAM-R" <SAM-R@news.postalias> wrote in message
> > news:eV8L5680GHA.1256@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...[color=darkred]
> >> Do you have a point to make? Because if you do, you have not made it.
> >> "Chad Harris" <RC1needs6months@theywanturmoney.net> wrote in message
> >> news:utyfOz20GHA.3716@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
> >>> "CLOSED WON'T FIX" 9/16/06
> >>>
> >>> All of these cheerleaders for MSFT who say they care what the public
> >>> files as to bugs should know they totally reject the idea of giving you
> >>> any meaningful access to the bugs filed on Connect.
> >>>
> >>> On 6/5/06, I used Connect's feedback program (which I suppose is
> >>> available to anyone) to suggest that they open bugs to the public as
> >>> well as their Beta Chats and their Live Meetings that approximately 110
> >>> people max attend on the average out of 27,000 TBTs.
> >>>
> >>> The resolution was "CLOSED WON'T FIX" 9/16/06 and even though I
> >>> designated it public, they took it private to hide it in keeping with
> >>> the devious MSFT no-transparency culture now fostered by the new
> >>> Sinofsky regime. It's the same culture that has MSFT turning over all
> >>> your MSN searches to the government and their security bloggers lying to
> >>> you about doing it as of their meeting June 1 and 2 in Washington, D.C.
> >>>
> >>> The suggestion complaint read:
> >>>
> >>> "MSFT has deployed an attitude of utmost contempt for the public and the
> >>> CPP by restricting information from them and defeating any semblance of
> >>> a learning curve. Connect blocks access to bug reports by the public.
> >>>
> >>> This is done with the intention of preventing their customsers from
> >>> contexting bugs, seeing bugs, realizing what won't be fixed or what is
> >>> deffered to "fix" and never will be by Blackcomb Vienna.
> >>>
> >>> MSFT further in the most quintissential anti-education posture possible
> >>> in contrast to the Gates Foundation stomps all over the learning curves
> >>> of their customers with respect to Vista by
> >>>
> >>> 1) denying them access to Beta chats where some real info is exchanged
> >>> that only approximately 100-200 people out of 27000 Beta testors in
> >>> different groups including but not restricted to TBT and TAP and those
> >>> added in the last few months. Instead of sensibly providing a central
> >>> link for all the chats on the MSFT web site, say
> >>> [url]http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista[/url] and the Technet site and MSDN they
> >>> hide the chats. Selected MSDN bloggers put selected chats on line, and
> >>> afik the chats aren't under any NDA. How inconsiderate to hide them from
> >>> the public.
> >>>
> >>> How anti learning for a company who considers its employees elete
> >>> applicants with creme de la crem academic pedigress although this is
> >>> hardly the case.
> >>>
> >>> 2) MSFT also denies their public customer base who put food on their
> >>> tables and toys in their homes access to multiple *Beta Live Meetings on
> >>> Vista (I'm not talking about the infrequent and question limited Technet
> >>> LMs) during the week and refuses to archive them. They have no more than
> >>> 200 and often less attendies. There are 27000 plus TBTs.
> >>>
> >>> 3) MSFT also restricts their Beta newsgroups from the public and there
> >>> is no reason to do so. The public Vista grousp are considerably less in
> >>> number, and the information is considerably less in quality with even
> >>> more newbie questions than on the TBT groups.
> >>>
> >>> MSFT's only regard for the public is in the context of a file and
> >>> settings transfer manger--to transfer as much bandwidth of cash into the
> >>> MSFT pockets from the public as possible.
> >>>
> >>> MSFT has Community Liasons assigned to key Vista teams who have not
> >>> lifted a finger to publish comprehensive information on the MSFT public
> >>> websites. Excellent information is available on MSDN and Technet blogs,
> >>> but they are known and used by a limited number and subset of people.
> >>>
> >>> No comprehensive and decent level information is available on SFC and
> >>> Win RE in Vista on any MSFT site. What is there is insulting to anyone
> >>> with an interest in Windows who is provides consistent considerable help
> >>> for your customers on your newsgroups.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Suggestion Category
> >>>
> >>> Feedback (Bugs and Suggestions)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Recommendation
> >>>
> >>> Correct this eggregious lack of information immediately.
> >>> 1) Make the Beta chats public and archive them in a central place and
> >>> showcase this on your community websites and Vista sites.
> >>> 2) Make the Beta Live Meetings all public and archive them in a
> >>> central place and showcase this on your community websites and Vista
> >>> sites.
> >>> 3) Stop hiding bug access for Beta testers. TBTs have offered to
> >>> check them for adults who are interested on your public newsgroups. That
> >>> arms length approach would be pathetic.
> >>> 4) The public doesn't have any feedback as to efforts they expend to
> >>> give you bug information. MSFT doesn't give a **** what the unwashed
> >>> public thinks. Your arrogance that cost you nearly 250 million and[/color][/color][/color]

If you can understand it, spelling becomes secondary on a newsgroup, but it
is important.

OBGs (Oldie But Goodies) always rock. For the record Dell Corporation, a
very tiny computer company in Round Rock Texas that MSFT pays no attention
to because they are small and they don't sell many computers, has told
MSFT's eggregious OEM VP (who is not trained as a software engineer but is
an accountant or money counter) Scott DiValerio to "shove it" and is
shipping Vista DVDs with OEM pre-installed Vista.

See:

Bloatware, Operating System Discs and Dell Software Support or Dell's plans
to tell MSFT to stuff it and ship Vista full OS DVDs with their computers
[url]http://www.direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2006/10/17/3132.aspx[/url]

Dell also kicked MSFT ads off their desktop and in their setup of Vista much
to MSFTies chagrin who is still playing catchup ball in advertising despite
billions of dollars to play with-- see

New Tricks: How Microsoft Is Learning to Love Online Advertising
By Robert A. Guth (Or How a Woman whose MSFT Boss Called Her Stupid All the
Time is making Billions for Softie Soft and got ole Yusuf Mehdi a brand new
VP title)

The Wall Street JournalNovember 16, 2006

[url]http://www.mediainfocenter.org/story.asp?story_id=100335522[/url]

Jim Allchin has blogged this week about partitions from that would have Win
RE's startup repair on it but offers no details and I don't believe Jim can
offer any substantive details on this. It's very common for MSFT personnel
to allude to alternatives for getting access to Win RE--and no doubt
enterprises have them. But I'm not worried about "Joe Blow Hummer 3" or
"Suzy Manolo Bahnik Shopping is the Way to Fight the War while making Sure
my family goes no where near the armed services--cause Gee all those coffins
coming in to Dover with no end in sight".

My concern is the Home and Small Business user being able to fix Vista No
Boots.

CH


"half alive authorized" <half alive [email]authorized@discussions.microsoft.com[/email]>
wrote in message news:4BAB76EE-D61A-44E6-A6CB-1BB0BD40916F@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
>
>
> "Chad Harris" wrote:
>[color=green]
>> Correction:
>>
>> Spelling:
>>
>>
>> No Sam--you can't read something clearly written with sufficient
>> comprehension. Try this. I'll do my best to me ake it clear. If it's
>> not--don't be shy and sing out. I'll parse it more clearly in the area
>> you
>> don't understand. If English is not your first language, I'll get it
>> translated. I aim to please you. I'm terribly honored by the
>> condescending,
>> dismissive tone of your question and glad to help. I also eagerly look
>> forward to the large volume of help you plan to post here--someday.
>>
>> My premise has been this:
>>
>>
>> MSFT is doing poorly at educating the public as to Vista, not to mention
>> they haven't been able to fix major components like Device Manager since
>> 1995. One of the major features of devmgmt.msc is to validate driver
>> health
>> and it doesn't. Google for the Beta driver chats.
>>
>> My points--and let me know if you need this made more clear or suscinct:
>>
>> 1) MSFT makes a disingenuous pomp and circumstance of encouraging
>> customer
>> feedback from the public. However they piss on that by not allowing
>> Connect
>> access to bugs. They make
>> the Beta available as a sales adjunct to the campaigns by Wagner Edstrom
>> and
>> McCann Ericson Worldwide. They hide bugs because they want to promote
>> sales
>> of a product that is going to ship broken that they didn't fix.
>>
>> 2) 2) To maximize education they need to make Beta Chats available in one
>> place
>> on ther sites and in an MSKB the way they make milestone build fixes
>> available in KBs you haven't seen.
>>
>> 3) To maximize education they need to make Beta Live Meetings available
>> on
>> their site.
>>
>> The reason I want these showcased and available is that they provide a
>> lot
>> of detail that answers questions people continue to ask.
>>
>> 4) This gives up nothing propiritiary and doesn't impact any vague lol
>> "security for their beta" whatsoever that Tom Ziegler very nebulously
>> alluded to saying MSFT had "their own reasons." It promotes education in
>> the same way that MSFT's pilot high school that purports to use only
>> laptops
>> and no books in Pennsylvanania that is in the news this week does.
>>
>> 5) want the public to be much better users. I want them to have a much
>> clearer understanding than they have of how to download RC1 and get
>> product
>> keys which seems the subject of endless obsession. I have seen people
>> told
>> repeatedly how to get RC1 and have done it myself and noticed that they
>> post
>> questions without doing a search on the group--they probably don't know
>> it
>> exists and are using the crappy web interface made by the MSFT communnity
>> instead of OE or Win Mail. Many of the questions here are asked hundreds
>> of
>> times because people are to lazy to search the answers that most of us
>> have
>> answered hundreds of times who do the answering.
>>
>> I realize that many of the people who ask these questions are a little
>> too
>> lazy to navigate to the MSFT sites and read them, so it becomes all the
>> more
>> imperative to up the level of education.
>>
>> I also think that those of us who work on newsgroups to help explain
>> features and fix Windows for MSFT's customers and sometimes evangelize
>> their
>> products are entitled to high qaulity Vista info. It isn't on MSFT's
>> site
>> on most of the major system features of Vista the way it was for XP at
>> the
>> stage between RC1 and RC2 during the late summer of 2001 before the
>> Windows
>> XP Launch on October 25, 2001.
>> I also understand a very small percent of XP users on the planet used
>> Help
>> and Support in XP, and I hope they will take advantage of the new Help
>> server for Vista as well as Guided Support's work in progress in Vista
>> should they need it.
>>
>> If this is not clear to you, by all means ask me to parse it. I was born
>> in
>> California, so I don't know if my command of English is up to the usual
>> sophisticated level you're accustomed to.
>>
>> I want to make it very clear.
>>
>> I also alluded to the fact that one of the major sales revenue streasms
>> to
>> customers of MSFT for Vista will be on pre-installed boxes. The major
>> repair modality for a no boot Vista is Win RE--and it's cheif component
>> is
>> Startup Repair located on the setup screen at the lower left as
>> "Recovery."
>>
>> The OEM purchasers will not have a Vista retail DVD due to a nasty policy
>> conjointly promoted by MSFT and its 30OEM "name partners" big guys like
>> Dell, HP, Sony who make among other things computers. . They will have
>> recovery CDs and hidden and non-hidden partitions that *WILL NOT* reach
>> Win
>> RE. This is analagous to the same arrangement in Win XP where the
>> recovery
>> discs and partitions would not do a repair install which is the chief
>> modality to fix a no boot XP after F8 Windows Advanced options fail.
>>
>> I have an additional challenge tailored just for Sam-R:
>>
>> You take what OEM sends you and choose any of your ten home boys and
>> girls
>> you think are superior Windows users. I'll take the retail XP CDs and
>> DVDs.
>> We''ll put up some substantial money and see who wins as to recovery with
>> what we each have to use.
>>
>> You game? Bring it.
>>
>> [Please let me know if you can't comprehend the *points* that have been
>> made
>> here Sam-R. I aim to please you and will be glad to refine the
>> clarification until you can comprehend it.]
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> CH
>>
>>
>>
>> "Chad Harris" <RC1needs6months@theywanturmoney.net> wrote in message
>> news:...[color=darkred]
>> > No Sam--you can't read something clearly written with sufficeint
>> > comprehension. Try this. I'll do my best to m ake it clear. If it's
>> > not--don't be shy and sing out. I'll parse it more clearly in the area
>> > you don't understand. If English is not your first language, I'll get
>> > it
>> > translated. I aim to please you. I'm terribly honored by the
>> > condescending tone of your question and glad to help.
>> >
>> > My premise has been this:
>> >
>> >
>> > MSFT is doing poorly at educating the public as to Vista, not to
>> > mention
>> > they haven't been able to fix major components like Device Manager
>> > since
>> > 1995. One of the major features of devmgmt.msc is to validate driver
>> > health and it doesn't. Google for the Beta driver chats.
>> >
>> > My points--and let me know if you need this made more clear or
>> > suscinct:
>> >
>> > 1) MSFT makes a disingenuous pomp and circumstance of encouraging
>> > customer
>> > feedback from the public.
>> > However they piss on that by not allowing Connect access to bugs. They
>> > make the Beta available as a sales adjunct to the campaings by Wagner
>> > Edstrom and McCann Ericson Worldwide. They hide bugs because they want
>> > to
>> > promote sales of a product that is going to ship broken that they
>> > didn't
>> > fix.
>> >
>> >
>> > 2) To maximize education they need to make Beta Chats available in one
>> > place on ther sites and in an MSKB the way they make milestone build
>> > fixes
>> > available in KBs you haven't seen.
>> >
>> > 3) To maximize education they need to make Beta Live Meetings available
>> > on
>> > their site.
>> >
>> > This gives up nothing propiritiary and doesn't impact any vague lol
>> > "security for their beta" whatsoever that Tom Ziegler very nebulously
>> > alluded to saying MSFT had "their own reasons." It promotes education
>> > in
>> > the same way that MSFT's pilot school in Pennsylvanania that is in the
>> > news this week does.
>> >
>> > I want the public to be much better users. I want them to have a much
>> > clearer u nderstanding than they have of how to download RC1 and get
>> > product keys which seems the subject of endless obsession.
>> >
>> > I realize that many of the people who ask these questions are a little
>> > too
>> > lazy to navigate to the MSFT sites and read them, so it becomes all the
>> > more imperative to up the level of education.
>> >
>> > I also think that those of us who work on newsgroups to help explain
>> > features and fix Windows for MSFT's customers and sometimes evangelize
>> > their products are entitled to high qaulity Vista info. It isn't on
>> > MSFT's site on most of the major system features of Vista the way it
>> > was
>> > for XP at the stage between RC1 and RC2 during the late summer of 2005.
>> >
>> > If this is not clear to you, by all means ask me to parse it. I was
>> > born
>> > in California, so I don't know if my command of English is up to the
>> > usual
>> > sophisticated level you're accustomed to.
>> >
>> > I want to make it very clear.
>> >
>> > I also alluded to the fact that one of the major sales revenue
>> > streasms
>> > to customers of MSFT for Vista will be on pre-installed boxes. The
>> > major
>> > repair modality for a no boot Vista is Win RE--and it's cheif component
>> > is
>> > Startup Repair located on the setup screen at the lower left as
>> > "Recovery." The OEM purchasers will not have a Vista retail DVD due to
>> > a
>> > nasty policy conjointly promoted by MSFT and its 30OEM "name partners"
>> > big guys like Dell, HP, Sony who make among other things computers. .
>> > They will have recovery CDs and hidden and non-hidden partitions that
>> > WILL
>> > NOT reach Win RE. This is analagous to the same arrangement in Win XP
>> > where the recovery discs and partitions would not do a repair install
>> > which is the chief modality to fix a no boot XP after F8 Windows
>> > Advanced
>> > options fail.
>> >
>> > I have an additional challenge for you:
>> >
>> > You take what OEM sends you and choose any of your ten home boys and
>> > girls
>> > you think are superior Windows users. I'll take the retail XP CDs and
>> > DVDs. We''ll put up some substantial money and see who wins as to
>> > recovery
>> > with what we each have to use.
>> >
>> > You game? Bring it.
>> >
>> > CH
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > "SAM-R" <SAM-R@news.postalias> wrote in message
>> > news:eV8L5680GHA.1256@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> >> Do you have a point to make? Because if you do, you have not made it.
>> >> "Chad Harris" <RC1needs6months@theywanturmoney.net> wrote in message
>> >> news:utyfOz20GHA.3716@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
>> >>> "CLOSED WON'T FIX" 9/16/06
>> >>>
>> >>> All of these cheerleaders for MSFT who say they care what the public
>> >>> files as to bugs should know they totally reject the idea of giving
>> >>> you
>> >>> any meaningful access to the bugs filed on Connect.
>> >>>
>> >>> On 6/5/06, I used Connect's feedback program (which I suppose is
>> >>> available to anyone) to suggest that they open bugs to the public as
>> >>> well as their Beta Chats and their Live Meetings that approximately
>> >>> 110
>> >>> people max attend on the average out of 27,000 TBTs.
>> >>>
>> >>> The resolution was "CLOSED WON'T FIX" 9/16/06 and even though I
>> >>> designated it public, they took it private to hide it in keeping with
>> >>> the devious MSFT no-transparency culture now fostered by the new
>> >>> Sinofsky regime. It's the same culture that has MSFT turning over all
>> >>> your MSN searches to the government and their security bloggers lying
>> >>> to
>> >>> you about doing it as of their meeting June 1 and 2 in Washington,
>> >>> D.C.
>> >>>
>> >>> The suggestion complaint read:
>> >>>
>> >>> "MSFT has deployed an attitude of utmost contempt for the public and
>> >>> the
>> >>> CPP by restricting information from them and defeating any semblance
>> >>> of
>> >>> a learning curve. Connect blocks access to bug reports by the
>> >>> public.
>> >>>
>> >>> This is done with the intention of preventing their customsers from
>> >>> contexting bugs, seeing bugs, realizing what won't be fixed or what
>> >>> is
>> >>> deffered to "fix" and never will be by Blackcomb Vienna.
>> >>>
>> >>> MSFT further in the most quintissential anti-education posture
>> >>> possible
>> >>> in contrast to the Gates Foundation stomps all over the learning
>> >>> curves
>> >>> of their customers with respect to Vista by
>> >>>
>> >>> 1) denying them access to Beta chats where some real info is
>> >>> exchanged
>> >>> that only approximately 100-200 people out of 27000 Beta testors in
>> >>> different groups including but not restricted to TBT and TAP and
>> >>> those
>> >>> added in the last few months. Instead of sensibly providing a central
>> >>> link for all the chats on the MSFT web site, say
>> >>> [url]http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista[/url] and the Technet site and MSDN
>> >>> they
>> >>> hide the chats. Selected MSDN bloggers put selected chats on line,
>> >>> and
>> >>> afik the chats aren't under any NDA. How inconsiderate to hide them
>> >>> from
>> >>> the public.
>> >>>
>> >>> How anti learning for a company who considers its employees elete
>> >>> applicants with creme de la crem academic pedigress although this is
>> >>> hardly the case.
>> >>>
>> >>> 2) MSFT also denies their public customer base who put food on their
>> >>> tables and toys in their homes access to multiple *Beta Live Meetings
>> >>> on
>> >>> Vista (I'm not talking about the infrequent and question limited
>> >>> Technet
>> >>> LMs) during the week and refuses to archive them. They have no more
>> >>> than
>> >>> 200 and often less attendies. There are 27000 plus TBTs.
>> >>>
>> >>> 3) MSFT also restricts their Beta newsgroups from the public and
>> >>> there
>> >>> is no reason to do so. The public Vista grousp are considerably less
>> >>> in
>> >>> number, and the information is considerably less in quality with even
>> >>> more newbie questions than on the TBT groups.
>> >>>
>> >>> MSFT's only regard for the public is in the context of a file and
>> >>> settings transfer manger--to transfer as much bandwidth of cash into
>> >>> the
>> >>> MSFT pockets from the public as possible.
>> >>>
>> >>> MSFT has Community Liasons assigned to key Vista teams who have not
>> >>> lifted a finger to publish comprehensive information on the MSFT
>> >>> public
>> >>> websites. Excellent information is available on MSDN and Technet
>> >>> blogs,
>> >>> but they are known and used by a limited number and subset of people.
>> >>>
>> >>> No comprehensive and decent level information is available on SFC and
>> >>> Win RE in Vista on any MSFT site. What is there is insulting to
>> >>> anyone
>> >>> with an interest in Windows who is provides consistent considerable
>> >>> help
>> >>> for your customers on your newsgroups.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Suggestion Category
>> >>>
>> >>> Feedback (Bugs and Suggestions)
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Recommendation
>> >>>
>> >>> Correct this eggregious lack of information immediately.
>> >>> 1) Make the Beta chats public and archive them in a central place
>> >>> and
>> >>> showcase this on your community websites and Vista sites.
>> >>> 2) Make the Beta Live Meetings all public and archive them in a
>> >>> central place and showcase this on your community websites and Vista
>> >>> sites.
>> >>> 3) Stop hiding bug access for Beta testers. TBTs have offered to
>> >>> check them for adults who are interested on your public newsgroups.
>> >>> That
>> >>> arms length approach would be pathetic.
>> >>> 4) The public doesn't have any feedback as to efforts they expend
>> >>> to
>> >>> give you bug information. MSFT doesn't give a **** what the unwashed
>> >>> public thinks. Your arrogance that cost you nearly 250 million and[/color][/color][/color]

If you can understand it, spelling becomes secondary on a newsgroup, but it
is important.

OBGs (Oldie But Goodies) always rock. For the record Dell Corporation, a
very tiny computer company in Round Rock Texas that MSFT pays no attention
to because they are small and they don't sell many computers, has told
MSFT's eggregious OEM VP (who is not trained as a software engineer but is
an accountant or money counter) Scott DiValerio to "shove it" and is
shipping Vista DVDs with OEM pre-installed Vista.

See:

Bloatware, Operating System Discs and Dell Software Support or Dell's plans
to tell MSFT to stuff it and ship Vista full OS DVDs with their computers
[url]http://www.direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2006/10/17/3132.aspx[/url]

Dell also kicked MSFT ads off their desktop and in their setup of Vista much
to MSFTies chagrin who is still playing catchup ball in advertising despite
billions of dollars to play with-- see

New Tricks: How Microsoft Is Learning to Love Online Advertising
By Robert A. Guth (Or How a Woman whose MSFT Boss Called Her Stupid All the
Time is making Billions for Softie Soft and got ole Yusuf Mehdi a brand new
VP title)

The Wall Street JournalNovember 16, 2006

[url]http://www.mediainfocenter.org/story.asp?story_id=100335522[/url]

Jim Allchin has blogged this week about partitions from that would have Win
RE's startup repair on it but offers no details and I don't believe Jim can
offer any substantive details on this. It's very common for MSFT personnel
to allude to alternatives for getting access to Win RE--and no doubt
enterprises have them. But I'm not worried about "Joe Blow Hummer 3" or
"Suzy Manolo Bahnik Shopping is the Way to Fight the War while making Sure
my family goes no where near the armed services--cause Gee all those coffins
coming in to Dover with no end in sight".

My concern is the Home and Small Business user being able to fix Vista No
Boots.

CH


"half alive authorized" <half alive [email]authorized@discussions.microsoft.com[/email]>
wrote in message news:4BAB76EE-D61A-44E6-A6CB-1BB0BD40916F@microsoft.com...[color=blue]
>
>
> "Chad Harris" wrote:
>[color=green]
>> Correction:
>>
>> Spelling:
>>
>>
>> No Sam--you can't read something clearly written with sufficient
>> comprehension. Try this. I'll do my best to me ake it clear. If it's
>> not--don't be shy and sing out. I'll parse it more clearly in the area
>> you
>> don't understand. If English is not your first language, I'll get it
>> translated. I aim to please you. I'm terribly honored by the
>> condescending,
>> dismissive tone of your question and glad to help. I also eagerly look
>> forward to the large volume of help you plan to post here--someday.
>>
>> My premise has been this:
>>
>>
>> MSFT is doing poorly at educating the public as to Vista, not to mention
>> they haven't been able to fix major components like Device Manager since
>> 1995. One of the major features of devmgmt.msc is to validate driver
>> health
>> and it doesn't. Google for the Beta driver chats.
>>
>> My points--and let me know if you need this made more clear or suscinct:
>>
>> 1) MSFT makes a disingenuous pomp and circumstance of encouraging
>> customer
>> feedback from the public. However they piss on that by not allowing
>> Connect
>> access to bugs. They make
>> the Beta available as a sales adjunct to the campaigns by Wagner Edstrom
>> and
>> McCann Ericson Worldwide. They hide bugs because they want to promote
>> sales
>> of a product that is going to ship broken that they didn't fix.
>>
>> 2) 2) To maximize education they need to make Beta Chats available in one
>> place
>> on ther sites and in an MSKB the way they make milestone build fixes
>> available in KBs you haven't seen.
>>
>> 3) To maximize education they need to make Beta Live Meetings available
>> on
>> their site.
>>
>> The reason I want these showcased and available is that they provide a
>> lot
>> of detail that answers questions people continue to ask.
>>
>> 4) This gives up nothing propiritiary and doesn't impact any vague lol
>> "security for their beta" whatsoever that Tom Ziegler very nebulously
>> alluded to saying MSFT had "their own reasons." It promotes education in
>> the same way that MSFT's pilot high school that purports to use only
>> laptops
>> and no books in Pennsylvanania that is in the news this week does.
>>
>> 5) want the public to be much better users. I want them to have a much
>> clearer understanding than they have of how to download RC1 and get
>> product
>> keys which seems the subject of endless obsession. I have seen people
>> told
>> repeatedly how to get RC1 and have done it myself and noticed that they
>> post
>> questions without doing a search on the group--they probably don't know
>> it
>> exists and are using the crappy web interface made by the MSFT communnity
>> instead of OE or Win Mail. Many of the questions here are asked hundreds
>> of
>> times because people are to lazy to search the answers that most of us
>> have
>> answered hundreds of times who do the answering.
>>
>> I realize that many of the people who ask these questions are a little
>> too
>> lazy to navigate to the MSFT sites and read them, so it becomes all the
>> more
>> imperative to up the level of education.
>>
>> I also think that those of us who work on newsgroups to help explain
>> features and fix Windows for MSFT's customers and sometimes evangelize
>> their
>> products are entitled to high qaulity Vista info. It isn't on MSFT's
>> site
>> on most of the major system features of Vista the way it was for XP at
>> the
>> stage between RC1 and RC2 during the late summer of 2001 before the
>> Windows
>> XP Launch on October 25, 2001.
>> I also understand a very small percent of XP users on the planet used
>> Help
>> and Support in XP, and I hope they will take advantage of the new Help
>> server for Vista as well as Guided Support's work in progress in Vista
>> should they need it.
>>
>> If this is not clear to you, by all means ask me to parse it. I was born
>> in
>> California, so I don't know if my command of English is up to the usual
>> sophisticated level you're accustomed to.
>>
>> I want to make it very clear.
>>
>> I also alluded to the fact that one of the major sales revenue streasms
>> to
>> customers of MSFT for Vista will be on pre-installed boxes. The major
>> repair modality for a no boot Vista is Win RE--and it's cheif component
>> is
>> Startup Repair located on the setup screen at the lower left as
>> "Recovery."
>>
>> The OEM purchasers will not have a Vista retail DVD due to a nasty policy
>> conjointly promoted by MSFT and its 30OEM "name partners" big guys like
>> Dell, HP, Sony who make among other things computers. . They will have
>> recovery CDs and hidden and non-hidden partitions that *WILL NOT* reach
>> Win
>> RE. This is analagous to the same arrangement in Win XP where the
>> recovery
>> discs and partitions would not do a repair install which is the chief
>> modality to fix a no boot XP after F8 Windows Advanced options fail.
>>
>> I have an additional challenge tailored just for Sam-R:
>>
>> You take what OEM sends you and choose any of your ten home boys and
>> girls
>> you think are superior Windows users. I'll take the retail XP CDs and
>> DVDs.
>> We''ll put up some substantial money and see who wins as to recovery with
>> what we each have to use.
>>
>> You game? Bring it.
>>
>> [Please let me know if you can't comprehend the *points* that have been
>> made
>> here Sam-R. I aim to please you and will be glad to refine the
>> clarification until you can comprehend it.]
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> CH
>>
>>
>>
>> "Chad Harris" <RC1needs6months@theywanturmoney.net> wrote in message
>> news:...[color=darkred]
>> > No Sam--you can't read something clearly written with sufficeint
>> > comprehension. Try this. I'll do my best to m ake it clear. If it's
>> > not--don't be shy and sing out. I'll parse it more clearly in the area
>> > you don't understand. If English is not your first language, I'll get
>> > it
>> > translated. I aim to please you. I'm terribly honored by the
>> > condescending tone of your question and glad to help.
>> >
>> > My premise has been this:
>> >
>> >
>> > MSFT is doing poorly at educating the public as to Vista, not to
>> > mention
>> > they haven't been able to fix major components like Device Manager
>> > since
>> > 1995. One of the major features of devmgmt.msc is to validate driver
>> > health and it doesn't. Google for the Beta driver chats.
>> >
>> > My points--and let me know if you need this made more clear or
>> > suscinct:
>> >
>> > 1) MSFT makes a disingenuous pomp and circumstance of encouraging
>> > customer
>> > feedback from the public.
>> > However they piss on that by not allowing Connect access to bugs. They
>> > make the Beta available as a sales adjunct to the campaings by Wagner
>> > Edstrom and McCann Ericson Worldwide. They hide bugs because they want
>> > to
>> > promote sales of a product that is going to ship broken that they
>> > didn't
>> > fix.
>> >
>> >
>> > 2) To maximize education they need to make Beta Chats available in one
>> > place on ther sites and in an MSKB the way they make milestone build
>> > fixes
>> > available in KBs you haven't seen.
>> >
>> > 3) To maximize education they need to make Beta Live Meetings available
>> > on
>> > their site.
>> >
>> > This gives up nothing propiritiary and doesn't impact any vague lol
>> > "security for their beta" whatsoever that Tom Ziegler very nebulously
>> > alluded to saying MSFT had "their own reasons." It promotes education
>> > in
>> > the same way that MSFT's pilot school in Pennsylvanania that is in the
>> > news this week does.
>> >
>> > I want the public to be much better users. I want them to have a much
>> > clearer u nderstanding than they have of how to download RC1 and get
>> > product keys which seems the subject of endless obsession.
>> >
>> > I realize that many of the people who ask these questions are a little
>> > too
>> > lazy to navigate to the MSFT sites and read them, so it becomes all the
>> > more imperative to up the level of education.
>> >
>> > I also think that those of us who work on newsgroups to help explain
>> > features and fix Windows for MSFT's customers and sometimes evangelize
>> > their products are entitled to high qaulity Vista info. It isn't on
>> > MSFT's site on most of the major system features of Vista the way it
>> > was
>> > for XP at the stage between RC1 and RC2 during the late summer of 2005.
>> >
>> > If this is not clear to you, by all means ask me to parse it. I was
>> > born
>> > in California, so I don't know if my command of English is up to the
>> > usual
>> > sophisticated level you're accustomed to.
>> >
>> > I want to make it very clear.
>> >
>> > I also alluded to the fact that one of the major sales revenue
>> > streasms
>> > to customers of MSFT for Vista will be on pre-installed boxes. The
>> > major
>> > repair modality for a no boot Vista is Win RE--and it's cheif component
>> > is
>> > Startup Repair located on the setup screen at the lower left as
>> > "Recovery." The OEM purchasers will not have a Vista retail DVD due to
>> > a
>> > nasty policy conjointly promoted by MSFT and its 30OEM "name partners"
>> > big guys like Dell, HP, Sony who make among other things computers. .
>> > They will have recovery CDs and hidden and non-hidden partitions that
>> > WILL
>> > NOT reach Win RE. This is analagous to the same arrangement in Win XP
>> > where the recovery discs and partitions would not do a repair install
>> > which is the chief modality to fix a no boot XP after F8 Windows
>> > Advanced
>> > options fail.
>> >
>> > I have an additional challenge for you:
>> >
>> > You take what OEM sends you and choose any of your ten home boys and
>> > girls
>> > you think are superior Windows users. I'll take the retail XP CDs and
>> > DVDs. We''ll put up some substantial money and see who wins as to
>> > recovery
>> > with what we each have to use.
>> >
>> > You game? Bring it.
>> >
>> > CH
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > "SAM-R" <SAM-R@news.postalias> wrote in message
>> > news:eV8L5680GHA.1256@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> >> Do you have a point to make? Because if you do, you have not made it.
>> >> "Chad Harris" <RC1needs6months@theywanturmoney.net> wrote in message
>> >> news:utyfOz20GHA.3716@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
>> >>> "CLOSED WON'T FIX" 9/16/06
>> >>>
>> >>> All of these cheerleaders for MSFT who say they care what the public
>> >>> files as to bugs should know they totally reject the idea of giving
>> >>> you
>> >>> any meaningful access to the bugs filed on Connect.
>> >>>
>> >>> On 6/5/06, I used Connect's feedback program (which I suppose is
>> >>> available to anyone) to suggest that they open bugs to the public as
>> >>> well as their Beta Chats and their Live Meetings that approximately
>> >>> 110
>> >>> people max attend on the average out of 27,000 TBTs.
>> >>>
>> >>> The resolution was "CLOSED WON'T FIX" 9/16/06 and even though I
>> >>> designated it public, they took it private to hide it in keeping with
>> >>> the devious MSFT no-transparency culture now fostered by the new
>> >>> Sinofsky regime. It's the same culture that has MSFT turning over all
>> >>> your MSN searches to the government and their security bloggers lying
>> >>> to
>> >>> you about doing it as of their meeting June 1 and 2 in Washington,
>> >>> D.C.
>> >>>
>> >>> The suggestion complaint read:
>> >>>
>> >>> "MSFT has deployed an attitude of utmost contempt for the public and
>> >>> the
>> >>> CPP by restricting information from them and defeating any semblance
>> >>> of
>> >>> a learning curve. Connect blocks access to bug reports by the
>> >>> public.
>> >>>
>> >>> This is done with the intention of preventing their customsers from
>> >>> contexting bugs, seeing bugs, realizing what won't be fixed or what
>> >>> is
>> >>> deffered to "fix" and never will be by Blackcomb Vienna.
>> >>>
>> >>> MSFT further in the most quintissential anti-education posture
>> >>> possible
>> >>> in contrast to the Gates Foundation stomps all over the learning
>> >>> curves
>> >>> of their customers with respect to Vista by
>> >>>
>> >>> 1) denying them access to Beta chats where some real info is
>> >>> exchanged
>> >>> that only approximately 100-200 people out of 27000 Beta testors in
>> >>> different groups including but not restricted to TBT and TAP and
>> >>> those
>> >>> added in the last few months. Instead of sensibly providing a central
>> >>> link for all the chats on the MSFT web site, say
>> >>> [url]http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista[/url] and the Technet site and MSDN
>> >>> they
>> >>> hide the chats. Selected MSDN bloggers put selected chats on line,
>> >>> and
>> >>> afik the chats aren't under any NDA. How inconsiderate to hide them
>> >>> from
>> >>> the public.
>> >>>
>> >>> How anti learning for a company who considers its employees elete
>> >>> applicants with creme de la crem academic pedigress although this is
>> >>> hardly the case.
>> >>>
>> >>> 2) MSFT also denies their public customer base who put food on their
>> >>> tables and toys in their homes access to multiple *Beta Live Meetings
>> >>> on
>> >>> Vista (I'm not talking about the infrequent and question limited
>> >>> Technet
>> >>> LMs) during the week and refuses to archive them. They have no more
>> >>> than
>> >>> 200 and often less attendies. There are 27000 plus TBTs.
>> >>>
>> >>> 3) MSFT also restricts their Beta newsgroups from the public and
>> >>> there
>> >>> is no reason to do so. The public Vista grousp are considerably less
>> >>> in
>> >>> number, and the information is considerably less in quality with even
>> >>> more newbie questions than on the TBT groups.
>> >>>
>> >>> MSFT's only regard for the public is in the context of a file and
>> >>> settings transfer manger--to transfer as much bandwidth of cash into
>> >>> the
>> >>> MSFT pockets from the public as possible.
>> >>>
>> >>> MSFT has Community Liasons assigned to key Vista teams who have not
>> >>> lifted a finger to publish comprehensive information on the MSFT
>> >>> public
>> >>> websites. Excellent information is available on MSDN and Technet
>> >>> blogs,
>> >>> but they are known and used by a limited number and subset of people.
>> >>>
>> >>> No comprehensive and decent level information is available on SFC and
>> >>> Win RE in Vista on any MSFT site. What is there is insulting to
>> >>> anyone
>> >>> with an interest in Windows who is provides consistent considerable
>> >>> help
>> >>> for your customers on your newsgroups.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Suggestion Category
>> >>>
>> >>> Feedback (Bugs and Suggestions)
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Recommendation
>> >>>
>> >>> Correct this eggregious lack of information immediately.
>> >>> 1) Make the Beta chats public and archive them in a central place
>> >>> and
>> >>> showcase this on your community websites and Vista sites.
>> >>> 2) Make the Beta Live Meetings all public and archive them in a
>> >>> central place and showcase this on your community websites and Vista
>> >>> sites.
>> >>> 3) Stop hiding bug access for Beta testers. TBTs have offered to
>> >>> check them for adults who are interested on your public newsgroups.
>> >>> That
>> >>> arms length approach would be pathetic.
>> >>> 4) The public doesn't have any feedback as to efforts they expend
>> >>> to
>> >>> give you bug information. MSFT doesn't give a **** what the unwashed
>> >>> public thinks. Your arrogance that cost you nearly 250 million and[/color][/color][/color]