Check out how here:

http://www.desicrazy.com/2008/03/03/...-wmwifirouter/

"RPOD" <poddarbiz******.com> wrote in message
news:7f839a89-e536-4891-85da-057443146e7a@i12g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> Check out how here:
>
> http://www.desicrazy.com/2008/03/03/...-wmwifirouter/

I think this post may have been borderline classifiable as spam, but I do
have to say that this product is interesting.

I have tried this the other day and it worked quite well. Makes you wonder
why the cell phone companies do not offer this - all the hardware is in
place in practically any capable smartphone/ppc.

Of course the product is not officially on the market yet, and I have no
ideal as to what the final price is going to be, but as a gadget it is cool.

On 4 Mar, 16:51, "xTenn" <xTennRemoveThisP...@tds.net> wrote:
> Makes you wonder
> why the cell phone companies do not offer this - all the hardware is in
> place in practically any capable smartphone/ppc.

I think the reasion for that is clear. So called "unlimited" data
usage packages on cell-phones are actually limited by two factors: the
total amount of useful data that people need to download to their
phone, and a "fair usage policy" that usually states a maximum
download limit per period.

Whilst the data is being downloaded by and for the cell-phone, data
levels will be of a predictable and lowish level. Once the cell-phone
is acting as a gateway for a laptop, then data transmission is likely
to increase significantly, and the cell-phone companies will need to
rein back on their "unlimited" offers.

--
WH

Please note that you've already got the chance to use your phone as a modem
for a notebook. Wi-Fi access is just another way to make a connection
between the two devices. With very few of them, I should add, as the
majority of people already uses BT or USB. That is, this program doesn't
increase (much) data traffic.



--


--
Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices
Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at
http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.


"William" <william@lowerknowle.com> wrote in message
news:bde2d109-6681-49d4-8d4e-9252866baa38@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> On 4 Mar, 16:51, "xTenn" <xTennRemoveThisP...@tds.net> wrote:
>> Makes you wonder
>> why the cell phone companies do not offer this - all the hardware is in
>> place in practically any capable smartphone/ppc.
>
> I think the reasion for that is clear. So called "unlimited" data
> usage packages on cell-phones are actually limited by two factors: the
> total amount of useful data that people need to download to their
> phone, and a "fair usage policy" that usually states a maximum
> download limit per period.
>
> Whilst the data is being downloaded by and for the cell-phone, data
> levels will be of a predictable and lowish level. Once the cell-phone
> is acting as a gateway for a laptop, then data transmission is likely
> to increase significantly, and the cell-phone companies will need to
> rein back on their "unlimited" offers.
>
> --
> WH

William <william@lowerknowle.com> writes:
>Whilst the data is being downloaded by and for the cell-phone, data
>levels will be of a predictable and lowish level. Once the cell-phone
>is acting as a gateway for a laptop, then data transmission is likely
>to increase significantly, and the cell-phone companies will need to
>rein back on their "unlimited" offers.

I use my AT&T WM6 phone as a router for my laptop all the
time, using the Internet Sharing application. Sometimes I
connect via Bluetooth PAN, sometimes via USB. AT&T has never
uttered a single word of complaint about this, probably
because I'M PAYING FOR THIS SERVICE. They're perfectly happy
to let you use your phone in this way as long as you pay a
monthly surcharge, which I am.

--
Help stop the genocide in Darfur!
http://www.genocideintervention.net/

On 4 Mar, 18:21, j...@kamens.brookline.ma.us (Jonathan Kamens) wrote:
> William <will...@lowerknowle.com> writes:
> >Whilst the data is being downloaded by and for the cell-phone, data
> >levels will be of a predictable and lowish level. Once the cell-phone
> >is acting as a gateway for a laptop, then data transmission is likely
> >to increase significantly, and the cell-phone companies will need to
> >rein back on their "unlimited" offers.
>
> I use my AT&T WM6 phone as a router for my laptop all the
> time, using the Internet Sharing application. *Sometimes I
> connect via Bluetooth PAN, sometimes via USB. *AT&T has never
> uttered a single word of complaint about this, probably
> because I'M PAYING FOR THIS SERVICE. *They're perfectly happy
> to let you use your phone in this way as long as you pay a
> monthly surcharge, which I am.

I'm sure they are happy to sell as much data time as they can can on a
per-byte basis, but if you are on an "all you can eat" tariff, they
won't want you to eat too much.

--
WH

William <william@lowerknowle.com> writes:
>I'm sure they are happy to sell as much data time as they can can on a
>per-byte basis, but if you are on an "all you can eat" tariff, they
>won't want you to eat too much.

I am in fact on an unlimited data plan. They know that I am
using that unlimited data plan for my laptop. I'm paying for
the privilege of doing that, and they have no problem with it.
I transmit many megabytes of data to and from my laptop
through my phone each month.

This is a common thing to do, done by many people with the
knowledge and consent of the cellular companies. For heaven's
sake, the software to do it is right there in full view on the
phone! It's also supported by Blackberrys and perhaps PalmOS
devices as well (I'm not certain about that).

Your claim that this is some sort of esoteric service that
the cellular companies don't know how to provide and don't
have enough bandwidth for is simply wrong.

You also seem to be missing the point that the product
documented in the URL referenced by the first post in this
thread is not designed to allow a single laptop to access the
Internet through the phone. It's designed to allow *any
number of* laptops to do it using standard WiFi access.

Now, that *is* something that the cellular companies don't
currently offer, and I'm sure you're right that they would not
be happy to find people doing it with their phones. Indeed,
AT&T's data service terms prohibit you to use one of their
phones to trasmit "data in conjunction with WWAN or other
applications or devices which aggregate usage from multiple
sources prior to transmission."

--
Help stop the genocide in Darfur!
http://www.genocideintervention.net/

"William" <william@lowerknowle.com> wrote in message
news:bde2d109-6681-49d4-8d4e-9252866baa38@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> On 4 Mar, 16:51, "xTenn" <xTennRemoveThisP...@tds.net> wrote:
>> Makes you wonder
>> why the cell phone companies do not offer this - all the hardware is in
>> place in practically any capable smartphone/ppc.
>
> I think the reasion for that is clear. So called "unlimited" data
> usage packages on cell-phones are actually limited by two factors: the
> total amount of useful data that people need to download to their
> phone, and a "fair usage policy" that usually states a maximum
> download limit per period.
>
> Whilst the data is being downloaded by and for the cell-phone, data
> levels will be of a predictable and lowish level. Once the cell-phone
> is acting as a gateway for a laptop, then data transmission is likely
> to increase significantly, and the cell-phone companies will need to
> rein back on their "unlimited" offers.
>


I think Menneisyys post summed up my thoughts - that the person who would be
doing this would probably already be doing sharing with their phone in
another method (USB or BT). That is, there is no real increase traffic
from what is already in place. Sad truth, there is a large segment of data
buyers that simply do not go beyond what comes on the phone.

But if they could market the smartphone as a wireless router to boot - they
could interest that crowd who understand wireless routers (simple as hooking
up any modern laptop) but have stayed away from Bluetooth. Seems like a
good marketing tool to sell Phone as Modem services (or rather Phone as
Wireless Router?).

On 4 Mar, 19:19, j...@kamens.brookline.ma.us (Jonathan Kamens) wrote:
> William <will...@lowerknowle.com> writes:
> >I'm sure they are happy to sell as much data time as they can can on a
> >per-byte basis, but if you are on an "all you can eat" tariff, they
> >won't want you to eat too much.
>
> I am in fact on an unlimited data plan. *They know that I am
> using that unlimited data plan for my laptop. *I'm paying for
> the privilege of doing that, and they have no problem with it.
> I transmit many megabytes of data to and from my laptop
> through my phone each month.

Fair enough. Sounds as though you are getting good vale from your data
plan.

> This is a common thing to do, done by many people with the
> knowledge and consent of the cellular companies. *For heaven's
> sake, the software to do it is right there in full view on the
> phone! *It's also supported by Blackberrys and perhaps PalmOS
> devices as well (I'm not certain about that).

Sure, I know all about that - I have the same facilities on my phones.

> Your claim that this is some sort of esoteric service that
> the cellular companies don't know how to provide and don't
> have enough bandwidth for is simply wrong.

It's wrong ok, but it isn't my claim.

> You also seem to be missing the point that the product
> documented in the URL referenced by the first post in this
> thread is not designed to allow a single laptop to access the
> Internet through the phone. *It's designed to allow *any
> number of* laptops to do it using standard WiFi access.

I'm not missing that point - that IS my point.

> Now, that *is* something that the cellular companies don't
> currently offer, and I'm sure you're right that they would not
> be happy to find people doing it with their phones.

Which is exactly what I was trying to say. Obviously I didn't express
myself clearly enough.

> *Indeed,
> AT&T's data service terms prohibit you to use one of their
> phones to trasmit "data in conjunction with WWAN or other
> applications or devices which aggregate usage from multiple
> sources prior to transmission."

So, there you have it. Not only do they not like it - they've already
prohibited it. Here's a further quote from AT&T's T&Cs for the
"unlimited" PDA plan:

"AT&T reserves the right to (i) limit throughput or amount of data
transferred and/or deny, disconnect, modify and/or terminate Service,
without notice, to anyone it believes is using the Service in any
manner prohibited or whose usage adversely impacts its wireless
network or service levels"

Try strapping 3 or 4 busy laptops to your "unlimited" plan, and
they're gonna invoke that clause.

--
WH

At 04 Mar 2008 10:32:32 -0800 William wrote:

> I'm sure they are happy to sell as much data time as they can can on a
> per-byte basis, but if you are on an "all you can eat" tariff, they
> won't want you to eat too much.


Here in the states they handle that a couple of different ways- either
through additional fees (i.e. "unlimited" data on phone only for $30,
unlimited on phone and tethering external PCs, $60) or through "soft
limits" (i.e. connection speed throttling or service termination warnings
if you exceed X# of GB.)

One carrier here (Verizon Wireless) has decided to end unlimited internet
plans (for new customers- old customers keep their existing plans.) They
charge $60 US for up to 5 GB, then $0.49 for each extra MB.

Unfortunately, it's impossible to use it as a fully-fledged wirelss router
as it's only over P2P connections (and not regular Access Point ones). In
addition, IIRC, it only allows for one connection at a time. In this, WinMo
phones are vastly different from WAN-enabled Wi-Fi routers.

--


--
Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices
Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at
http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.


"xTenn" <xTennRemoveThisPart@tds.net> wrote in message
news:Oct1N9ifIHA.5752@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
>
> "William" <william@lowerknowle.com> wrote in message
> news:bde2d109-6681-49d4-8d4e-9252866baa38@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>> On 4 Mar, 16:51, "xTenn" <xTennRemoveThisP...@tds.net> wrote:
>>> Makes you wonder
>>> why the cell phone companies do not offer this - all the hardware is in
>>> place in practically any capable smartphone/ppc.
>>
>> I think the reasion for that is clear. So called "unlimited" data
>> usage packages on cell-phones are actually limited by two factors: the
>> total amount of useful data that people need to download to their
>> phone, and a "fair usage policy" that usually states a maximum
>> download limit per period.
>>
>> Whilst the data is being downloaded by and for the cell-phone, data
>> levels will be of a predictable and lowish level. Once the cell-phone
>> is acting as a gateway for a laptop, then data transmission is likely
>> to increase significantly, and the cell-phone companies will need to
>> rein back on their "unlimited" offers.
>>
>
>
> I think Menneisyys post summed up my thoughts - that the person who would
> be doing this would probably already be doing sharing with their phone in
> another method (USB or BT). That is, there is no real increase traffic
> from what is already in place. Sad truth, there is a large segment of
> data buyers that simply do not go beyond what comes on the phone.
>
> But if they could market the smartphone as a wireless router to boot -
> they could interest that crowd who understand wireless routers (simple as
> hooking up any modern laptop) but have stayed away from Bluetooth. Seems
> like a good marketing tool to sell Phone as Modem services (or rather
> Phone as Wireless Router?).
>
>
>

"Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices]"
<!ei.maileja@kiitos!> wrote in message
news:eTFPSupfIHA.1132@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

> In addition, IIRC, it only allows for one connection at a time. <

That works to its advantage, since there could not be a group of laptops
abusing a single connection, which seems to be a concern elsewhere in this
thread.

But, I completely agree with you about the differences between regular
router and WinMo. It is merely similar. Similar enough, though?

"Todd Allcock" <elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in message
news:fqkrnk$etr$1@aioe.org...
> At 04 Mar 2008 10:32:32 -0800 William wrote:


> then $0.49 for each extra MB. <

Ouch, They seem to have defined >5gb as bad intent, sine that rate is not
realistic.

"xTenn" <xTennRemoveThisPart@tds.net> wrote in message
news:Ox$Xr1sfIHA.1900@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>
> "Todd Allcock" <elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in message
> news:fqkrnk$etr$1@aioe.org...
>> At 04 Mar 2008 10:32:32 -0800 William wrote:
>
>
>> then $0.49 for each extra MB. <
>
> Ouch, They seem to have defined >5gb as bad intent, sine that rate is
> not realistic.


Yeah, Verizon has a particularly restrictive ToS- essentially you're allowed
to use it for e-mail, web browsing, and VPN to a corporate network only.

Nope, it's not that similar - p2p and access point modes are pretty
different.

--


--
Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices
Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at
http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.


"xTenn" <xTennRemoveThisPart@tds.net> wrote in message
news:%23MK23zsfIHA.4396@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>
> "Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices]"
> <!ei.maileja@kiitos!> wrote in message
> news:eTFPSupfIHA.1132@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>
>> In addition, IIRC, it only allows for one connection at a time. <
>
> That works to its advantage, since there could not be a group of laptops
> abusing a single connection, which seems to be a concern elsewhere in this
> thread.
>
> But, I completely agree with you about the differences between regular
> router and WinMo. It is merely similar. Similar enough, though?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>