Happy Oyster wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 15:27:44 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:
>
>> Not sure why one would need to fight a Windows install problem if it had
>> to do with existing partitions.
>
> One of the problems is that XP rapes the first partition. I had to use a Linux
> DVD to boot and to change the first partition to be of some off Unix type. THIS
> XP did not touch and in the first run of the installation copied its stuff to
> the second partition where it has to be. Making the first partition invisible
> does not work as then XP thinks it is in the first and messes up its boot record
> THE WRONG WAY.
>
> First step:
>
> To handle the HDD (has serial ATA) partition the HDD and format the partitions
> with Linux. THAT WORKS.
>
>
> Second step:
>
> Change the type of those partitions XP has to keep its fingers off to some wierd
> Unix type.
>
>
> Third step:
>
> As XP is ****ed stupid, IF you also want a Linux on the machine, install that as
> the first OS. THEN install Win XP. This way you can start (with the help of a
> boot CD/DVD (like Super-GRUB) into a working system to check the other
> partitions, etc.
>
>
> Fourth step:
>
> XP will mess up the MBR, so with the Linux DVD to boot, use GRUB and get the MBR
> stuff back to order.
>
> BUT to get that right, the partition types of "wierd Unix" must be set back to
> the right values BEFORE you can work on GRUB.
>
> If you messed up something, then a complete Linux installation will be the last
> step.
>
>
> Problems of the XP installer are that it messes up with partitions, reboot, etc.
>
> To get around this, use a Super-GRUB CD and for doing the second part of the XP
> install (which is from HDD): use the CD to boot from the Win XP partition.
>
> This works with serial ATA.
>
>
> There are TWO CDs which accompany the netbooks. One is the "recovery CD" with
> the pure OS (in a miserable state), the other is for the additions, drivers,
> etc. That one must be installed after XP is installed.
>
> I called a LG tech suppport because I feared that the OS CD already contains
> some special stuff for the machine. But I was told that I could use a totally
> neutral XP installation CD because all the specific stuff is on the second CD.
>
> Without the second CD, I'm afraid, one doesn't get very far: It contains the
> drivers for the chipsets and without these the machine is cut off even from the
> basic hardware...
>
> Aribert Deckers


There is a really simple solution to a Windows-Linux dual boot problem.
Two hard drives... Ben Myers

BillW50 wrote:
> In news:h93me1$an5$1@news.eternal-september.org,
> Barry Watzman typed on Sat, 19 Sep 2009 18:36:47 -0400:
>> ... but it requires a
>> floppy disk drive, and absent BIOS emulation support (which most
>> modern motherboards and laptops do have, but which older ones don't)
>> the floppy disk has to be "real" and not USB (again, most modern
>> systems, however, do support USB emulation, and, also in many cases,
>> SATA emulation)...
>
> Just to be clear... virtually all modern day BIOS *will* totally accept
> USB floppy drives as *real* floppy drives. Same is true of USB hard
> drives and optical drives as well. That doesn't mean the OS will though.
> As that is totally different.
>
Well, if the motherboard BIOS masks from the OS the fact that a drive is
USB, the OS won't know, won't care, and will go blithely ahead and use
it like any other drive. Of course, there is no standard for a
motherboard BIOS, and Micro$oft may have something written into its OEM
contracts to actually prohibit a BIOS smarter than it is... Ben Myers

Happy Oyster wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 17:22:42 -0500, "BillW50" <BillW50@aol.kom> wrote:
>
>> In news:b8jab554p21d8ou81sb63mmahr1npc2v93@4ax.com,
>> Happy Oyster typed on Sat, 19 Sep 2009 23:49:38 +0200:
>>> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 15:27:44 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Not sure why one would need to fight a Windows install problem if it
>>>> had to do with existing partitions.
>>> One of the problems is that XP rapes the first partition.
>> It only changes the first active partition. That could be one of four
>> partitions and it doesn't have to be the first one (with Vista and
>> Windows 7, it is zillions of partitions). And any Linux partition using
>> ext2/3, Windows won't touch it. Aribert doesn't even know this.
>> Otherwise he wouldn't be experiencing any of this.
>
> I don't give a **** about which type of partitions IN SPECIAL XP can handle. I
> chose a very strange one because I did not want to have to try again.
>
> Also, I do not discuss with XP. I roast it.
>
>
>>> I had to
>>> use a Linux DVD to boot and to change the first partition to be of
>>> some off Unix type. THIS XP did not touch and in the first run of the
>>> installation copied its stuff to the second partition where it has to
>>> be. Making the first partition invisible does not work as then XP
>>> thinks it is in the first and messes up its boot record THE WRONG WAY.
>>>
>>> First step:
>>>
>>> To handle the HDD (has serial ATA) partition the HDD and format the
>>> partitions with Linux. THAT WORKS.
>>>
>>>
>>> Second step:
>>>
>>> Change the type of those partitions XP has to keep its fingers off to
>>> some wierd Unix type.
>>>
>>>
>>> Third step:
>>>
>>> As XP is ****ed stupid, IF you also want a Linux on the machine,
>>> install that as the first OS. THEN install Win XP. This way you can
>>> start (with the help of a boot CD/DVD (like Super-GRUB) into a
>>> working system to check the other partitions, etc.
>>>
>>>
>>> Fourth step:
>>>
>>> XP will mess up the MBR, so with the Linux DVD to boot, use GRUB and
>>> get the MBR stuff back to order.
>>>
>>> BUT to get that right, the partition types of "wierd Unix" must be
>>> set back to the right values BEFORE you can work on GRUB.
>>>
>>> If you messed up something, then a complete Linux installation will
>>> be the last step.
>>>
>>>
>>> Problems of the XP installer are that it messes up with partitions,
>>> reboot, etc.
>>>
>>> To get around this, use a Super-GRUB CD and for doing the second part
>>> of the XP install (which is from HDD): use the CD to boot from the
>>> Win XP partition.
>>>
>>> This works with serial ATA.
>>>
>>>
>>> There are TWO CDs which accompany the netbooks. One is the "recovery
>>> CD" with the pure OS (in a miserable state), the other is for the
>>> additions, drivers, etc. That one must be installed after XP is
>>> installed.
>>>
>>> I called a LG tech suppport because I feared that the OS CD already
>>> contains some special stuff for the machine. But I was told that I
>>> could use a totally neutral XP installation CD because all the
>>> specific stuff is on the second CD.
>>>
>>> Without the second CD, I'm afraid, one doesn't get very far: It
>>> contains the drivers for the chipsets and without these the machine
>>> is cut off even from the basic hardware...
>> And if you boot up Ubuntu Live and not even touching the hard drive at
>> all, Ubuntu modifies your Windows partition (happened to me three times
>> and to somebody else). And when you install Linux after Windows it
>> screws up your Windows installation.
>>
>> But what Aribert won't tell you is that UNIX/Linux isn't very useful at
>> all. Nor is the security very good at all. Rootkits came out first from
>> the Unix/Linux world and not from the Windows world (by about 15 years).
>> Some distros doesn't even have a firewall. And Linux doesn't have a
>> 100th of the applications that Windows has. No, Aribert won't tell you
>> any of this stuff. Why? Because he is afraid too. <grin>

If XP is that bad for you, why do you even use it at all? ... Ben Myers

Happy Oyster wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 17:22:42 -0500, "BillW50" <BillW50@aol.kom> wrote:
>
>> In news:b8jab554p21d8ou81sb63mmahr1npc2v93@4ax.com,
>> Happy Oyster typed on Sat, 19 Sep 2009 23:49:38 +0200:
>>> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 15:27:44 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Not sure why one would need to fight a Windows install problem if it
>>>> had to do with existing partitions.
>>> One of the problems is that XP rapes the first partition.
>> It only changes the first active partition. That could be one of four
>> partitions and it doesn't have to be the first one (with Vista and
>> Windows 7, it is zillions of partitions). And any Linux partition using
>> ext2/3, Windows won't touch it. Aribert doesn't even know this.
>> Otherwise he wouldn't be experiencing any of this.
>
> I don't give a **** about which type of partitions IN SPECIAL XP can handle. I
> chose a very strange one because I did not want to have to try again.
>
> Also, I do not discuss with XP. I roast it.
>
>
>>> I had to
>>> use a Linux DVD to boot and to change the first partition to be of
>>> some off Unix type. THIS XP did not touch and in the first run of the
>>> installation copied its stuff to the second partition where it has to
>>> be. Making the first partition invisible does not work as then XP
>>> thinks it is in the first and messes up its boot record THE WRONG WAY.
>>>
>>> First step:
>>>
>>> To handle the HDD (has serial ATA) partition the HDD and format the
>>> partitions with Linux. THAT WORKS.
>>>
>>>
>>> Second step:
>>>
>>> Change the type of those partitions XP has to keep its fingers off to
>>> some wierd Unix type.
>>>
>>>
>>> Third step:
>>>
>>> As XP is ****ed stupid, IF you also want a Linux on the machine,
>>> install that as the first OS. THEN install Win XP. This way you can
>>> start (with the help of a boot CD/DVD (like Super-GRUB) into a
>>> working system to check the other partitions, etc.
>>>
>>>
>>> Fourth step:
>>>
>>> XP will mess up the MBR, so with the Linux DVD to boot, use GRUB and
>>> get the MBR stuff back to order.
>>>
>>> BUT to get that right, the partition types of "wierd Unix" must be
>>> set back to the right values BEFORE you can work on GRUB.
>>>
>>> If you messed up something, then a complete Linux installation will
>>> be the last step.
>>>
>>>
>>> Problems of the XP installer are that it messes up with partitions,
>>> reboot, etc.
>>>
>>> To get around this, use a Super-GRUB CD and for doing the second part
>>> of the XP install (which is from HDD): use the CD to boot from the
>>> Win XP partition.
>>>
>>> This works with serial ATA.
>>>
>>>
>>> There are TWO CDs which accompany the netbooks. One is the "recovery
>>> CD" with the pure OS (in a miserable state), the other is for the
>>> additions, drivers, etc. That one must be installed after XP is
>>> installed.
>>>
>>> I called a LG tech suppport because I feared that the OS CD already
>>> contains some special stuff for the machine. But I was told that I
>>> could use a totally neutral XP installation CD because all the
>>> specific stuff is on the second CD.
>>>
>>> Without the second CD, I'm afraid, one doesn't get very far: It
>>> contains the drivers for the chipsets and without these the machine
>>> is cut off even from the basic hardware...
>> And if you boot up Ubuntu Live and not even touching the hard drive at
>> all, Ubuntu modifies your Windows partition (happened to me three times
>> and to somebody else). And when you install Linux after Windows it
>> screws up your Windows installation.
>>
>> But what Aribert won't tell you is that UNIX/Linux isn't very useful at
>> all. Nor is the security very good at all. Rootkits came out first from
>> the Unix/Linux world and not from the Windows world (by about 15 years).
>> Some distros doesn't even have a firewall. And Linux doesn't have a
>> 100th of the applications that Windows has. No, Aribert won't tell you
>> any of this stuff. Why? Because he is afraid too. <grin>

Or, to paraphrase the great Bard, as Aribert implies: "I come to bury
Windows, not to praise it. The evil that men do lives after them; The
good is oft interred with their bones. So let it be with Windows. The
noble Justice Department (circa 1994) hath told you Windows was
ambitious. If it were so, it was a grievous fault. And grievously hath
Windows answer'd it."

.... Ben Myers

In news:h9407o$f4t$2@news.eternal-september.org,
Ben Myers typed on Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:24:08 -0400:
> BillW50 wrote:
>> In news:h93me1$an5$1@news.eternal-september.org,
>> Barry Watzman typed on Sat, 19 Sep 2009 18:36:47 -0400:
>>> ... but it requires a
>>> floppy disk drive, and absent BIOS emulation support (which most
>>> modern motherboards and laptops do have, but which older ones don't)
>>> the floppy disk has to be "real" and not USB (again, most modern
>>> systems, however, do support USB emulation, and, also in many cases,
>>> SATA emulation)...
>>
>> Just to be clear... virtually all modern day BIOS *will* totally
>> accept USB floppy drives as *real* floppy drives. Same is true of
>> USB hard drives and optical drives as well. That doesn't mean the OS
>> will though. As that is totally different.
>>
> Well, if the motherboard BIOS masks from the OS the fact that a drive
> is USB, the OS won't know, won't care, and will go blithely ahead and
> use it like any other drive. Of course, there is no standard for a
> motherboard BIOS, and Micro$oft may have something written into its
> OEM contracts to actually prohibit a BIOS smarter than it is... Ben
> Myers

More like Microsoft when it boots up and resets the USB ports then
checks to see what is connected to them. Now the BIOS has no say so
anymore. And good thing too. As most BIOS use USB v1.ax speeds for
compatibility reasons. So you would be stuck in low speed all of the
time. <vbg>

--
Bill
Windows 2000 SP4 (5.00.2195)
Asus EEE PC 701G4 ~ 2GB RAM ~ 16GB-SDHC

On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:21:09 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:

>There is a really simple solution to a Windows-Linux dual boot problem.
> Two hard drives... Ben Myers

IF you are able to install a second drive. But in a netbook you do not have this
choice.

Also, the installation is not as simple as you think, because IF there is a
choice for a second HDD, on that HDD willl be more OSes installed. With 2 HDDs
it is 3+3= 6 OSes or 3+4 = 7 OSes.

If it is only 1 HDD, it is a meager 3 OSes. ;O)

And not to forget: the other OSes are in virtual machines... The number dpends
on the size of the HDD(s).
--
The big "gmt"-scam

http://www.ariplex.com/ama/ama_gmt1.htm

On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:25:07 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:

>If XP is that bad for you, why do you even use it at all? ... Ben Myers

For 2 simple reasons:

1. Needed for some special communications protocol.

2. Needed for some special sanning purposes, for which Linux does not have the
right programs.
--
The big "gmt"-scam

http://www.ariplex.com/ama/ama_gmt1.htm

On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 17:22:42 -0500, "BillW50" <BillW50@aol.kom> wrote:

>And if you boot up Ubuntu Live and not even touching the hard drive at
>all, Ubuntu modifies your Windows partition (happened to me three times
>and to somebody else). And when you install Linux after Windows it
>screws up your Windows installation.

Ubuntu is one of the most insane things I ever saw. It is disgusting. Ubuntu is
just as usefull as "filled" baby diapers in a ventilator fan. It is an insult to
any human brain.


>But what Aribert won't tell you is that UNIX/Linux isn't very useful at
>all. Nor is the security very good at all. Rootkits came out first from
>the Unix/Linux world and not from the Windows world (by about 15 years).
>Some distros doesn't even have a firewall. And Linux doesn't have a
>100th of the applications that Windows has. No, Aribert won't tell you
>any of this stuff. Why? Because he is afraid too. <grin>

The only problem with the Linux programmers is that they are schizophrenic: they
claim to be better than Microsoft, but they copy Microsoft's mess.

The problem with nearly ALL programmers: they have no clues about a work should
be done effectively. One of the best examples: WordStar. This program (latest
sold version dates from 1992) still is better than all of those sold later. For
17 years the programmers on earth were (and are) too ****ed stupid to keep up
with that fine piece of artwork. WordStar, by the way, runs on DOS. This is the
reason why I still use DOS.
--
The big "gmt"-scam

http://www.ariplex.com/ama/ama_gmt1.htm

On Sun, 20 Sep 2009 04:44:17 +0200, Happy Oyster
<happy.oyster@ariplex.com> wrote:

>On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 17:22:42 -0500, "BillW50" <BillW50@aol.kom> wrote:
>
>>And if you boot up Ubuntu Live and not even touching the hard drive at
>>all, Ubuntu modifies your Windows partition (happened to me three times
>>and to somebody else). And when you install Linux after Windows it
>>screws up your Windows installation.
>
>Ubuntu is one of the most insane things I ever saw. It is disgusting. Ubuntu is
>just as usefull as "filled" baby diapers in a ventilator fan. It is an insult to
>any human brain.
>
>
>>But what Aribert won't tell you is that UNIX/Linux isn't very useful at
>>all. Nor is the security very good at all. Rootkits came out first from
>>the Unix/Linux world and not from the Windows world (by about 15 years).
>>Some distros doesn't even have a firewall. And Linux doesn't have a
>>100th of the applications that Windows has. No, Aribert won't tell you
>>any of this stuff. Why? Because he is afraid too. <grin>
>
>The only problem with the Linux programmers is that they are schizophrenic: they
>claim to be better than Microsoft, but they copy Microsoft's mess.
>
>The problem with nearly ALL programmers: they have no clues about a work should
>be done effectively. One of the best examples: WordStar. This program (latest
>sold version dates from 1992) still is better than all of those sold later. For
>17 years the programmers on earth were (and are) too ****ed stupid to keep up
>with that fine piece of artwork. WordStar, by the way, runs on DOS. This is the
>reason why I still use DOS.


Honestly I don't use dos programs any more but I won't laugh at you
for saying this because I like the old dos programs for two reasons.
They were a lot less bloated (actually not bloated) and you had better
control over them or behind them... ie: desqview386 and qemm5.1 .

Happy Oyster wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:21:09 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:
>
>> There is a really simple solution to a Windows-Linux dual boot problem.
>> Two hard drives... Ben Myers
>
> IF you are able to install a second drive. But in a netbook you do not have this
> choice.
>
> Also, the installation is not as simple as you think, because IF there is a
> choice for a second HDD, on that HDD willl be more OSes installed. With 2 HDDs
> it is 3+3= 6 OSes or 3+4 = 7 OSes.
>
> If it is only 1 HDD, it is a meager 3 OSes. ;O)
>
> And not to forget: the other OSes are in virtual machines... The number dpends
> on the size of the HDD(s).

Sure you have a choice. Remove one drive and pop in a second one... Ben

Happy Oyster wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:25:07 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:
>
>> If XP is that bad for you, why do you even use it at all? ... Ben Myers
>
> For 2 simple reasons:
>
> 1. Needed for some special communications protocol.
>
> 2. Needed for some special sanning purposes, for which Linux does not have the
> right programs.

Oh, then Windows XP isn't so bad after all... Ben

On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 23:53:28 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:

>>> There is a really simple solution to a Windows-Linux dual boot problem.
>>> Two hard drives... Ben Myers
>>
>> IF you are able to install a second drive. But in a netbook you do not have this
>> choice.

>Sure you have a choice. Remove one drive and pop in a second one... Ben

I am only talking about the things built-in.
--
"Syrer besetzten die Städte,
frevelten dort um die Wette.
Wollten von Jahwe nichts wissen,
wurden von Löwen zerrissen." http://www.reimbibel.de

On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 23:53:59 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:

>Happy Oyster wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:25:07 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:
>>
>>> If XP is that bad for you, why do you even use it at all? ... Ben Myers
>>
>> For 2 simple reasons:
>>
>> 1. Needed for some special communications protocol.
>>
>> 2. Needed for some special sanning purposes, for which Linux does not have the
>> right programs.
>
>Oh, then Windows XP isn't so bad after all... Ben

XP is ****. If you change the memory size, of even if memory fails the WGA
Nazidom shows up.
--
"Syrer besetzten die Städte,
frevelten dort um die Wette.
Wollten von Jahwe nichts wissen,
wurden von Löwen zerrissen." http://www.reimbibel.de

In news:h5abb5dbn06aeib7l29dr2cha4hhdhl4dg@4ax.com,
Happy Oyster typed on Sun, 20 Sep 2009 06:01:45 +0200:
> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 23:53:28 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net>
> wrote:
>
>>>> There is a really simple solution to a Windows-Linux dual boot
>>>> problem. Two hard drives... Ben Myers
>>>
>>> IF you are able to install a second drive. But in a netbook you do
>>> not have this choice.
>
>> Sure you have a choice. Remove one drive and pop in a second one...
>> Ben
>
> I am only talking about the things built-in.

Why are you buying non-removable drives in netbooks and then complaining
about them? I have two Asus EeePC 702 and I swap out the SSD drives all
of the time. And each one has a different OS on them.

--
Bill
Windows 2000 SP4 (5.00.2195)
Asus EEE PC 701G4 ~ 2GB RAM ~ 16GB-SDHC

In news:j9abb5l9785qudm6ibme1h8b3tft9pgng4@4ax.com,
Happy Oyster typed on Sun, 20 Sep 2009 06:02:57 +0200:
> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 23:53:59 -0400, Ben Myers <ben_myers@charter.net>
> wrote:
>
>> Happy Oyster wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:25:07 -0400, Ben Myers
>>> <ben_myers@charter.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> If XP is that bad for you, why do you even use it at all? ... Ben
>>>> Myers
>>>
>>> For 2 simple reasons:
>>>
>>> 1. Needed for some special communications protocol.
>>>
>>> 2. Needed for some special sanning purposes, for which Linux does
>>> not have the right programs.
>>
>> Oh, then Windows XP isn't so bad after all... Ben
>
> XP is ****. If you change the memory size, of even if memory fails
> the WGA Nazidom shows up.

I have heard of this but I have never seen it myself. Although I only
use non-WGA copies of Windows XP. Why did you purchase a WGA one?

--
Bill
Windows 2000 SP4 (5.00.2195)
Asus EEE PC 701G4 ~ 2GB RAM ~ 16GB-SDHC