While using my Toshiba Qosmio X305-Q701 the other night my display went
from 'running on AC' bright, to 'running on battery' not so bright.

It does run on battery; I had shut down the computer, then restarted it
on battery long enough to copy some needed files, then re-shutdown.

Research in this newsgroup and on the internet shows that I either have
a dead adapter or a loose internal power connection.

Using a multimeter I checked the voltage at the tip of the DC plug. The
rated voltage is 19 VDC, but I only get a 160 mV. The strange thing is,
I get 160 mV *consistently* and repeatably. If I got zero volts I could
easily say "dead brick".

Is it possible that the adapter puts out 160 mV until it senses it is
plugged in to a real load, then jacks up to 19 V? Or is it just a dumb
brick that should be putting out 19 volts regardless of it being plugged in?

Any other suggestions for home diagnostics I could try before taking it
in for repairs would also be welcome.

--
I'm glad my Mom named me Aaron,
That's what everybody calls me.

In news:HoBwl.1059$6%.898@nwrddc01.gnilink.net,
Aaron typed on Fri, 20 Mar 2009 00:26:15 GMT:
> While using my Toshiba Qosmio X305-Q701 the other night my display
> went from 'running on AC' bright, to 'running on battery' not so
> bright.
> It does run on battery; I had shut down the computer, then restarted
> it on battery long enough to copy some needed files, then re-shutdown.
>
> Research in this newsgroup and on the internet shows that I either
> have a dead adapter or a loose internal power connection.
>
> Using a multimeter I checked the voltage at the tip of the DC plug.
> The rated voltage is 19 VDC, but I only get a 160 mV. The strange
> thing is, I get 160 mV *consistently* and repeatably. If I got zero
> volts I
> could easily say "dead brick".
>
> Is it possible that the adapter puts out 160 mV until it senses it is
> plugged in to a real load, then jacks up to 19 V? Or is it just a dumb
> brick that should be putting out 19 volts regardless of it being
> plugged in?
> Any other suggestions for home diagnostics I could try before taking
> it in for repairs would also be welcome.

It could be a smart brick and waiting for a load. But since your laptop
doesn't see the brick either, it is a pretty good bet it died. And since
they are pretty cheap anyway, it is about as cheap as you are going to
get to find out the answer. Sorry I can't tell you more unless you want
to disassemble the laptop. Or cut into the cord to measure the voltage
under load.

--
Bill
Asus EEE PC 701G4 ~ 2GB RAM ~ 16GB-SDHC
Windows XP SP2

Re: "Research in this newsgroup and on the internet shows that I either
have a dead adapter or a loose internal power connection."

There are other possibilities, but by far those are the most likely.
But not the only ones.

Re: "Is it possible that the adapter puts out 160 mV until it senses it
is plugged in to a real load, then jacks up to 19 V?"

That is possible, depending on the design of the power supply (AC
adapter). But I think it's unlikely, I think it's more likely that you
have a bad adapter. It would be best to test the adapter with at least
a bit of load. Get a 180 ohm resistor and put that across the adapter
output, then measure the voltage across the resistor. [You could also
use a 12 volt light bulb (car lamps are 12 volts, just get an interior
or instrument panel bulb (not a headlight)); it will burn out fairly
quickly, and it will be VERY bright, but it will probably not burn out
instantly. If it doesn't light AT ALL, then the adapter is dead.] A
180 watt resistor will draw about 2 watts (so get a 2 watt resistor) and
will get kind of warm.


Aaron wrote:
> While using my Toshiba Qosmio X305-Q701 the other night my display went
> from 'running on AC' bright, to 'running on battery' not so bright.
>
> It does run on battery; I had shut down the computer, then restarted it
> on battery long enough to copy some needed files, then re-shutdown.
>
> Research in this newsgroup and on the internet shows that I either have
> a dead adapter or a loose internal power connection.
>
> Using a multimeter I checked the voltage at the tip of the DC plug. The
> rated voltage is 19 VDC, but I only get a 160 mV. The strange thing is,
> I get 160 mV *consistently* and repeatably. If I got zero volts I could
> easily say "dead brick".
>
> Is it possible that the adapter puts out 160 mV until it senses it is
> plugged in to a real load, then jacks up to 19 V? Or is it just a dumb
> brick that should be putting out 19 volts regardless of it being plugged
> in?
>
> Any other suggestions for home diagnostics I could try before taking it
> in for repairs would also be welcome.
>

>> While using my Toshiba Qosmio X305-Q701 the other night my display
>> went from 'running on AC' bright, to 'running on battery' not so
>> bright.
>> It does run on battery; I had shut down the computer, then restarted
>> it on battery long enough to copy some needed files, then re-shutdown.
>>
>> Research in this newsgroup and on the internet shows that I either
>> have a dead adapter or a loose internal power connection.
>>
>> Using a multimeter I checked the voltage at the tip of the DC plug.
>> The rated voltage is 19 VDC, but I only get a 160 mV. The strange
>> thing is, I get 160 mV *consistently* and repeatably. If I got zero
>> volts I could easily say "dead brick".
>>
>> Is it possible that the adapter puts out 160 mV until it senses it is
>> plugged in to a real load, then jacks up to 19 V? Or is it just a dumb
>> brick that should be putting out 19 volts regardless of it being
>> plugged in?
>> Any other suggestions for home diagnostics I could try before taking
>> it in for repairs would also be welcome.
>
> It could be a smart brick and waiting for a load. But since your laptop
> doesn't see the brick either, it is a pretty good bet it died. And since
> they are pretty cheap anyway, it is about as cheap as you are going to
> get to find out the answer. Sorry I can't tell you more unless you want
> to disassemble the laptop. Or cut into the cord to measure the voltage
> under load.

Barry also suggested testing under, load with a resistor or auto lamp,
so you both are thinking on he same line. Sounds like a trip to Radio
Shack is in order.

Many thanks.

--
I'm glad my Mom named me Aaron,
That's what everybody calls me.

> Re: "Is it possible that the adapter puts out 160 mV until it senses it
> is plugged in to a real load, then jacks up to 19 V?"
>
> That is possible, depending on the design of the power supply (AC
> adapter). But I think it's unlikely, I think it's more likely that you
> have a bad adapter. It would be best to test the adapter with at least
> a bit of load. Get a 180 ohm resistor and put that across the adapter
> output, then measure the voltage across the resistor. [You could also
> use a 12 volt light bulb (car lamps are 12 volts, just get an interior
> or instrument panel bulb (not a headlight)); it will burn out fairly
> quickly, and it will be VERY bright, but it will probably not burn out
> instantly. If it doesn't light AT ALL, then the adapter is dead.] A
> 180 watt resistor will draw about 2 watts (so get a 2 watt resistor) and
> will get kind of warm.

Testing under load is something I can manage. :)
Now for a trip to Radio Shack, or Auto Zone.

Many thanks; I'll post to let you know how it works out.

>> Any other suggestions for home diagnostics I could try before taking
>> it in for repairs would also be welcome.

--
I'm glad my Mom named me Aaron,
That's what everybody calls me.

In news:coGwl.1275$SU3.76@nwrddc02.gnilink.net,
Aaron typed on Fri, 20 Mar 2009 06:07:04 GMT:
>> Re: "Is it possible that the adapter puts out 160 mV until it senses
>> it is plugged in to a real load, then jacks up to 19 V?"
>>
>> That is possible, depending on the design of the power supply (AC
>> adapter). But I think it's unlikely, I think it's more likely that
>> you have a bad adapter. It would be best to test the adapter with
>> at least a bit of load. Get a 180 ohm resistor and put that across
>> the adapter output, then measure the voltage across the resistor.
>> [You could also use a 12 volt light bulb (car lamps are 12 volts,
>> just get an interior or instrument panel bulb (not a headlight)); it
>> will burn out fairly quickly, and it will be VERY bright, but it
>> will probably not burn out instantly. If it doesn't light AT ALL,
>> then the adapter is dead.] A 180 watt resistor will draw about 2
>> watts (so get a 2 watt resistor) and will get kind of warm.
>
> Testing under load is something I can manage. :)
> Now for a trip to Radio Shack, or Auto Zone.
>
> Many thanks; I'll post to let you know how it works out.
>
>>> Any other suggestions for home diagnostics I could try before taking
>>> it in for repairs would also be welcome.

The kicker of course, if it is a smart adapter... it may not fire up
with just any load. As some of them need to be told from the load who is
connected. Meaning am I connected to a Toshiba model that I am safe to
run with? Of course, a lamp or the wrong laptop won't answer or answer
incorrectly. So that may tell you nothing.

Also Barry must be talking about a 180 ohm resistor @ 2 watts instead of
a 180 watt resistor. As resistors in that wattage isn't really called
resistors anymore. As they are commonly known as heaters instead. ;-)

--
Bill
Asus EEE PC 701G4 ~ 2GB RAM ~ 16GB-SDHC
Windows XP SP2

I did say 180 watt resistor in one place when I meant 180 ohm (I said
180 ohm, correctly, in the first instance).

MOST (almost all) Toshiba laptops use "dumb" AC adapters with just
coaxial barrel 2-wire connectors. But there are a few exceptions.


BillW50 wrote:
> In news:coGwl.1275$SU3.76@nwrddc02.gnilink.net,
> Aaron typed on Fri, 20 Mar 2009 06:07:04 GMT:
>>> Re: "Is it possible that the adapter puts out 160 mV until it senses
>>> it is plugged in to a real load, then jacks up to 19 V?"
>>>
>>> That is possible, depending on the design of the power supply (AC
>>> adapter). But I think it's unlikely, I think it's more likely that
>>> you have a bad adapter. It would be best to test the adapter with
>>> at least a bit of load. Get a 180 ohm resistor and put that across
>>> the adapter output, then measure the voltage across the resistor.
>>> [You could also use a 12 volt light bulb (car lamps are 12 volts,
>>> just get an interior or instrument panel bulb (not a headlight)); it
>>> will burn out fairly quickly, and it will be VERY bright, but it
>>> will probably not burn out instantly. If it doesn't light AT ALL,
>>> then the adapter is dead.] A 180 watt resistor will draw about 2
>>> watts (so get a 2 watt resistor) and will get kind of warm.
>> Testing under load is something I can manage. :)
>> Now for a trip to Radio Shack, or Auto Zone.
>>
>> Many thanks; I'll post to let you know how it works out.
>>
>>>> Any other suggestions for home diagnostics I could try before taking
>>>> it in for repairs would also be welcome.
>
> The kicker of course, if it is a smart adapter... it may not fire up
> with just any load. As some of them need to be told from the load who is
> connected. Meaning am I connected to a Toshiba model that I am safe to
> run with? Of course, a lamp or the wrong laptop won't answer or answer
> incorrectly. So that may tell you nothing.
>
> Also Barry must be talking about a 180 ohm resistor @ 2 watts instead of
> a 180 watt resistor. As resistors in that wattage isn't really called
> resistors anymore. As they are commonly known as heaters instead. ;-)
>

"BillW50" <BillW50@aol.kom> wrote in news:gpvqt3$vl0$1@nntp.motzarella.org:

> The kicker of course, if it is a smart adapter... it may not fire up
> with just any load. As some of them need to be told from the load who is
> connected. Meaning am I connected to a Toshiba model that I am safe to
> run with? Of course, a lamp or the wrong laptop won't answer or answer
> incorrectly. So that may tell you nothing.
>
>

Many switching power supplies used to charge batteries are looking for some
level of battery voltage before they will turn on. Simply hooking them to
a resistor does not provide this "Hey, my battery needs charging so power
me." message. So, the switcher thinks the battery is kaput and doesn't
power up as it may cause a fire in Li-Ion batteries. It's a fire safety
issue. We've all seen what can happen to craptops that don't have this
safety feature.

In news:Xns9BD4836FAAC47noonehomecom@74.209.131.13,
Larry typed on Fri, 20 Mar 2009 16:55:13 +0000:
> "BillW50" <BillW50@aol.kom> wrote in
> news:gpvqt3$vl0$1@nntp.motzarella.org:
>
>> The kicker of course, if it is a smart adapter... it may not fire up
>> with just any load. As some of them need to be told from the load
>> who is connected. Meaning am I connected to a Toshiba model that I
>> am safe to run with? Of course, a lamp or the wrong laptop won't
>> answer or answer incorrectly. So that may tell you nothing.
>
> Many switching power supplies used to charge batteries are looking
> for some level of battery voltage before they will turn on. Simply
> hooking them to a resistor does not provide this "Hey, my battery
> needs charging so power me." message. So, the switcher thinks the
> battery is kaput and doesn't power up as it may cause a fire in
> Li-Ion batteries. It's a fire safety issue. We've all seen what can
> happen to craptops that don't have this safety feature.

Greetings Larry! Yes this is so true. Although Aaron stated that the LCD
backlight dimmed to battery power status while on AC. And all
indications was it was on battery power. And even ran it off of battery
power.

So while the no charge could be a low battery causing the safety
circuits to refuse to charge the battery. But the laptop switching over
from mains to battery doesn't sound like the battery. Plus running off
of battery power alone doesn't sound like a low battery either. Although
Aaron could prove it by removing the battery and seeing if it will fire
up. It just might, chances are slim I would think. But still possible.

--
Bill
Asus EEE PC 701G4 ~ 2GB RAM ~ 16GB-SDHC
Windows XP SP2

Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:

>Many switching power supplies used to charge batteries are looking for some
>level of battery voltage before they will turn on.

If that were true a laptop would not run with the battery removed...

And in this particular case the battery was still in the laptop when
the *supply failed* and it switched to battery power and kept running.
My guess is that the tiny voltage the OP is seeing is some leakage.
Even though the supply is likely failed there still can be voltages in
there depending on which part failed.

>So, the switcher thinks the battery is kaput and doesn't
>power up as it may cause a fire in Li-Ion batteries.

The circuitry that protects the Lion battery is built into the
battery, not the external power supply.

NO laptop supply works that way, however. [One proof of that is that I
don't recall ever having seen a laptop that would not work with
batteries entirely removed, although there may have been a few at one
point or another).

All laptops have a fairly complex and sophisticated switching power
supply inside the laptop, usually on the motherboard. It supplies all
of the power for the laptop, including in most cases charging the
batteries. The external AC adapter is just an input to that supply.


Larry wrote:

>
> Many switching power supplies used to charge batteries are looking for some
> level of battery voltage before they will turn on. Simply hooking them to
> a resistor does not provide this "Hey, my battery needs charging so power
> me." message. So, the switcher thinks the battery is kaput and doesn't
> power up as it may cause a fire in Li-Ion batteries. It's a fire safety
> issue. We've all seen what can happen to craptops that don't have this
> safety feature.
>

Using info from posts here and from my...ahem...user's guide, I removed
the battery for a while (overnight) then plugged in on AC power without
the battery. To my surprise the little red AC light came on, which it
most definitely did not do before. I gently wiggled and twisted the plug
at the computer to see i there might be loose connections inside, no
change. I unplugged the AC, put the battery in, re-attached AC and let
the battery charge while running errands. It has been working fine ever
since.

I thank all respondents who assisted, but now I am totally confused as
to what the problem was.

--

I'm glad my Mom named me Aaron,
That's what everybody calls me.

Using info from posts here and from my...ahem...user's guide, I removed
the battery for a while (overnight) then plugged in on AC power without
the battery. To my surprise the little red AC light came on, which it
most definitely did not do before. I gently wiggled and twisted the plug
at the computer to see i there might be loose connections inside, no
change. I unplugged the AC, put the battery in, re-attached AC and let
the battery charge while running errands. It has been working fine ever
since.

I thank all respondents who assisted, but now I am totally confused as
to what the problem was.

--

I'm glad my Mom named me Aaron,
That's what everybody calls me.

In news:8PBxl.1547$6%.39@nwrddc01.gnilink.net,
Aaron typed onn Mon, 23 Mar 2009 01:43:32 GMT:
> Using info from posts here and from my...ahem...user's guide, I
> removed the battery for a while (overnight) then plugged in on AC
> power without the battery. To my surprise the little red AC light
> came on, which it most definitely did not do before. I gently wiggled
> and twisted the plug at the computer to see i there might be loose
> connections inside, no change. I unplugged the AC, put the battery
> in, re-attached AC and let the battery charge while running errands.
> It has been working fine ever since.
>
> I thank all respondents who assisted, but now I am totally confused as
> to what the problem was.

Greetings Aaron! That is completely understandable! As you are dealing
with digital electronics. And in the simplest terms, digital electronics
is nothing more than just a series of zillions of electronical switches.
And pretty amazingly, they all work all according to plan 99.999% of the
time. Although once in a blue moon, a stray electron, a gamma ray, a
ghost, a fubar, or something else unexplainable causes the near
impossible to happen. One darn switch gets toggled to the wrong
position.

When this happens, one just needs to just reboot and the problem
disappears. Although there are two kinds of reboots. One is a warm
reboot which most people know about. And the other is a cold reboot (the
master of all reboots). Which requires all traveling electrons to stop
moving about and all circuits to be neutralized so that all of the
electronic switches can be reset. By removing all power (including the
main battery) performs this cold reboot. And you fixed it by performing
a cold reboot. Congratulations! ;-)

--
Bill
Asus EEE PC 701G4 ~ 2GB RAM ~ 16GB-SDHC
Windows XP SP2

In news:8PBxl.1547$6%.39@nwrddc01.gnilink.net,
Aaron typed onn Mon, 23 Mar 2009 01:43:32 GMT:
> Using info from posts here and from my...ahem...user's guide, I
> removed the battery for a while (overnight) then plugged in on AC
> power without the battery. To my surprise the little red AC light
> came on, which it most definitely did not do before. I gently wiggled
> and twisted the plug at the computer to see i there might be loose
> connections inside, no change. I unplugged the AC, put the battery
> in, re-attached AC and let the battery charge while running errands.
> It has been working fine ever since.
>
> I thank all respondents who assisted, but now I am totally confused as
> to what the problem was.

Greetings Aaron! That is completely understandable! As you are dealing
with digital electronics. And in the simplest terms, digital electronics
is nothing more than just a series of zillions of electronical switches.
And pretty amazingly, they all work all according to plan 99.999% of the
time. Although once in a blue moon, a stray electron, a gamma ray, a
ghost, a fubar, or something else unexplainable causes the near
impossible to happen. One darn switch gets toggled to the wrong
position.

When this happens, one just needs to just reboot and the problem
disappears. Although there are two kinds of reboots. One is a warm
reboot which most people know about. And the other is a cold reboot (the
master of all reboots). Which requires all traveling electrons to stop
moving about and all circuits to be neutralized so that all of the
electronic switches can be reset. By removing all power (including the
main battery) performs this cold reboot. And you fixed it by performing
a cold reboot. Congratulations! ;-)

--
Bill
Asus EEE PC 701G4 ~ 2GB RAM ~ 16GB-SDHC
Windows XP SP2