I was earlier looking at a MacBook Pro for my son. The problem is the
cost was higher than we wanted and we later realized he didn't need
the portability since he has a computer in his classroom. He lives in
a dorm and we're worried about theft. A laptop is just so easy to
steal and with a desktop it can be more easily secured.
Anyway, this takes us to which one to get. I know there's a Mac Pro or
something like that that is a 2 chip dual core system for $2400 or so.
That's more than we want. It seems that leaves me with the mac mini
or the imac. Honestly I have to say both me and my wife kind of got
hooked on the mac after seeing our son use it and since we both are
heavily into graphics work we're thinking it may be worth switching
from Windows to Mac. The thing is because we have Windows PC's which
we have so much software for we will use both the Windows and Mac's at
the same time. We decided to stay away from the boot camp windows/mac
option at this time. The Mac Mini seems like a cheap solution,
especially considering for $70 we can get a keyboard/mouse combo and
then just use the 19 inch LCD monitors we already have. The Mac Mini
is nice and compact. I like the power of the imac more but with the
monitors and computers we have we really don't want to deal with th
etwo monitors and I'm sure you can't buy a imac and then sell the
monitor since it's built into one unit.
I guess one of my questions, if we get a mac mini we'd go with the
dual core option which is 1.66 ghz. is this enough power? It seems
I'd want closer to 2.0ghz. most of the software will be the Office
Suite, Adobe Suite and the Macromedia Suite for uses such as email,
internet browsing, word processing, some desktop publishing, graphic
editing, web page development, and even some editing of digital video
so I know I need power. Is 1.66ghz dual core enough? That's my only
concern. how much ram would I need? I know it comes with 512 and
I'd upgrade it to at least 1 gig if not 2 gigs. As for hard drive
space, I'd likely take the 80 gig to at least 100 if not 120 gigs.
Like I said I know the imac would have more power but it wouldn't work
well in the situation I have.
That leads me to another question. I know some of these options are
cheaper if done outside of Apple such as buying it with 512megs and
then buying the memory on my own. What type of memory do I have to
buy for the mac mini? Also, how hard is it to upgrade the hard drive.
I was wondering if it's possible to get the 80 gig version and then
buy a 120 gig separately and then set it up for the mac. Are the
applications/restore DVD's included and is it easy to set up the new
hard drive or is this a hard procedure?
Next, I know these intel macs are new but are there any new macs comin
out just around the corner? I just like the idea of the mac mini but
want more power. Is it in any way possible to upgrade the CPU in the
mac mini? I know this is a lot of upgrades but I've done a lot of work
with PC's including building my own. of course this is PC, not Mac
but I'm familiar with computer hardware.
Also, me and my wife have to travel on business frequently. Has
anyone used a mac mini as a portable? It's so small that it seems it
could be taken in a small carry bag with a portable sized mouse and
keyboard. Is the mac mini capable of handling the jolts of traveling
though? For use outside of a hotel room are there power options with
a battery that would supply power to it? I have a adaptor for my
laptop that takes the vga output and puts it onto standard rca plugs
for a TV.
Since we are getting potentially 3 machines other than educational
discounts does anyone sell in volume discounts?
I know this is many questions. This is a whole new frontier for me
but I feel with timeI may be using the mac more than 50% of the time.
This is just all so new to me and thanks for all the help.

I forgot to post this in the earlier message. I realized the graphics
processor is different in the imac vs. the mac mini. We won't do any
gaming on these machines. Yet we will do work with Adobe, Desktop
Publishing, Video Editing, Photo Editing, and Office applications.
Will the graphics processing of the mini handle this?

I forgot to post this in the earlier message. I realized the graphics
processor is different in the imac vs. the mac mini. We won't do any
gaming on these machines. Yet we will do work with Adobe, Desktop
Publishing, Video Editing, Photo Editing, and Office applications.
Will the graphics processing of the mini handle this?

In article <s3qme2l4g7ceacg79c1fg86g60eg8ume19@4ax.com>,
MarkW <markwco@RemoveNoSpamcomcast.net> wrote:

> I was earlier looking at a MacBook Pro for my son. ... He lives in
> a dorm and we're worried about theft. A laptop is just so easy to
> steal and with a desktop it can be more easily secured.

You could consider the MacBook (not the MacBook Pro), as this has many
(most?) of the capabilities of the higher priced MacBook Pro. Personally
I anticipate the MacBook Pro being upgraded with a new chip well before
the MacBook, so I would hang back on buying it even it it fitted my
purposes exactly.

> That's more than we want. It seems that leaves me with the mac mini
> or the imac.

Back about 18 months I figured optioning a Mac mini closer to an iMac
brought the prices rather close together. Plus the iMac can take far
larger hard drives than the Mac mini (although you can use external
drives with either). Against this, the Mac mini is obviously designed
for the classroom.

Regarding security and theft, you will notice most Macintosh have a
security slot, for connection of a security cable. In a dorm situation,
that would be a first line of defence (if used consistently). Adding one
of the "call home" software protections would be another. Plus checking
whether your insurance can cover it.

> I guess one of my questions, if we get a mac mini we'd go with the
> dual core option which is 1.66 ghz. is this enough power? It seems
> I'd want closer to 2.0ghz. most of the software will be the Office
> Suite, Adobe Suite and the Macromedia Suite

Microsoft and Adobe have not as yet converted Office nor the Adobe and
Macromedia products into a form that runs on the Intel based Macintosh.
I wouldn't expect them to manage this until at least next year. If you
run Windows PCs, you probably do not already own copies of the Macintosh
versions of these products. If you did own them, they would need to run
under Apple's Rosetta emulation, and the performance would be much
slower. If these specific products are essential for courses, and going
to be in heavy use, you probably shouldn't consider a Macintosh until
the Microsoft and Adobe software have been converted to Universal.

> for uses such as email,
> internet browsing, word processing, some desktop publishing, graphic
> editing, web page development, and even some editing of digital video
> so I know I need power. Is 1.66ghz dual core enough?

If using Universal applications (and the Apple ones that come with a
Macintosh are all Intel capable) the speed will probably be fine. Most
of the tasks you mention are handled by applications that are included
with the Macintosh.

Getting more memory would be worthwhile. On the other hand, an external
hard drive is likely to be cheaper than upgrading the internal one. Plus
you could use an external for backing up. I wouldn't even think about
upgrading the internal hard drive myself. The Mac mini isn't intended to
be opened. Think of it as an appliance. Buy, plug it in, it works, never
touch it again (except via keyboard).

> want more power. Is it in any way possible to upgrade the CPU in the
> mac mini? I know this is a lot of upgrades but I've done a lot of work
> with PC's including building my own. of course this is PC, not Mac
> but I'm familiar with computer hardware.

There are reports that the Mac mini CPU is in a socket, and there are
reports of it being upgraded by others. That said, the Mac mini (and the
iMac) are NOT designed like regular desktop PC. They are not designed to
be opened. They are not designed to be upgraded. They are totally unlike
the open plug in architecture of a desktop PC. If you think of both the
iMac and the Mac mini are being laptops packaged in a different manner
you are closer to their design philosophy. The only Macintosh designed
to be opened is the Mac Pro (which is really easy to upgrade).

The fact that you have built a PC isn't sufficient experience to deal
with laptop style construction. Anyone with a screwdriver can learn to
assemble a desktop PC. If you haven't disassembled and assembled again a
few laptops, I would forget doing your own upgrades. That said, there
are lots of sites on the web that provide the instructions, and it isn't
rocket science, just tedious, painstaking and delicate.

> Also, me and my wife have to travel on business frequently. Has
> anyone used a mac mini as a portable? It's so small that it seems it
> could be taken in a small carry bag with a portable sized mouse and
> keyboard.

Mac mini is fine as a travelling computer, especially if there is a
monitor available at the other end. The power pack is separate (like a
giant laptop power pack). However the MacBook laptop is even better as a
portable. If I were moving between a couple of offices (home and work
maybe) I'd think a Mac mini would be fine. But for business travel to
hotels, I'd do it the way other travellers do, and use a laptop. Your
time is almost surely worth the difference in cost.

--
http://www.ericlindsay.com

In article <s3qme2l4g7ceacg79c1fg86g60eg8ume19@4ax.com>,
MarkW <markwco@RemoveNoSpamcomcast.net> wrote:

> I was earlier looking at a MacBook Pro for my son. ... He lives in
> a dorm and we're worried about theft. A laptop is just so easy to
> steal and with a desktop it can be more easily secured.

You could consider the MacBook (not the MacBook Pro), as this has many
(most?) of the capabilities of the higher priced MacBook Pro. Personally
I anticipate the MacBook Pro being upgraded with a new chip well before
the MacBook, so I would hang back on buying it even it it fitted my
purposes exactly.

> That's more than we want. It seems that leaves me with the mac mini
> or the imac.

Back about 18 months I figured optioning a Mac mini closer to an iMac
brought the prices rather close together. Plus the iMac can take far
larger hard drives than the Mac mini (although you can use external
drives with either). Against this, the Mac mini is obviously designed
for the classroom.

Regarding security and theft, you will notice most Macintosh have a
security slot, for connection of a security cable. In a dorm situation,
that would be a first line of defence (if used consistently). Adding one
of the "call home" software protections would be another. Plus checking
whether your insurance can cover it.

> I guess one of my questions, if we get a mac mini we'd go with the
> dual core option which is 1.66 ghz. is this enough power? It seems
> I'd want closer to 2.0ghz. most of the software will be the Office
> Suite, Adobe Suite and the Macromedia Suite

Microsoft and Adobe have not as yet converted Office nor the Adobe and
Macromedia products into a form that runs on the Intel based Macintosh.
I wouldn't expect them to manage this until at least next year. If you
run Windows PCs, you probably do not already own copies of the Macintosh
versions of these products. If you did own them, they would need to run
under Apple's Rosetta emulation, and the performance would be much
slower. If these specific products are essential for courses, and going
to be in heavy use, you probably shouldn't consider a Macintosh until
the Microsoft and Adobe software have been converted to Universal.

> for uses such as email,
> internet browsing, word processing, some desktop publishing, graphic
> editing, web page development, and even some editing of digital video
> so I know I need power. Is 1.66ghz dual core enough?

If using Universal applications (and the Apple ones that come with a
Macintosh are all Intel capable) the speed will probably be fine. Most
of the tasks you mention are handled by applications that are included
with the Macintosh.

Getting more memory would be worthwhile. On the other hand, an external
hard drive is likely to be cheaper than upgrading the internal one. Plus
you could use an external for backing up. I wouldn't even think about
upgrading the internal hard drive myself. The Mac mini isn't intended to
be opened. Think of it as an appliance. Buy, plug it in, it works, never
touch it again (except via keyboard).

> want more power. Is it in any way possible to upgrade the CPU in the
> mac mini? I know this is a lot of upgrades but I've done a lot of work
> with PC's including building my own. of course this is PC, not Mac
> but I'm familiar with computer hardware.

There are reports that the Mac mini CPU is in a socket, and there are
reports of it being upgraded by others. That said, the Mac mini (and the
iMac) are NOT designed like regular desktop PC. They are not designed to
be opened. They are not designed to be upgraded. They are totally unlike
the open plug in architecture of a desktop PC. If you think of both the
iMac and the Mac mini are being laptops packaged in a different manner
you are closer to their design philosophy. The only Macintosh designed
to be opened is the Mac Pro (which is really easy to upgrade).

The fact that you have built a PC isn't sufficient experience to deal
with laptop style construction. Anyone with a screwdriver can learn to
assemble a desktop PC. If you haven't disassembled and assembled again a
few laptops, I would forget doing your own upgrades. That said, there
are lots of sites on the web that provide the instructions, and it isn't
rocket science, just tedious, painstaking and delicate.

> Also, me and my wife have to travel on business frequently. Has
> anyone used a mac mini as a portable? It's so small that it seems it
> could be taken in a small carry bag with a portable sized mouse and
> keyboard.

Mac mini is fine as a travelling computer, especially if there is a
monitor available at the other end. The power pack is separate (like a
giant laptop power pack). However the MacBook laptop is even better as a
portable. If I were moving between a couple of offices (home and work
maybe) I'd think a Mac mini would be fine. But for business travel to
hotels, I'd do it the way other travellers do, and use a laptop. Your
time is almost surely worth the difference in cost.

--
http://www.ericlindsay.com

In article <NOSPAmar2005-CCF196.11210924082006@freenews.iinet.net.au>,
Eric Lindsay <NOSPAmar2005@ericlindsay.com> wrote:

> In article <s3qme2l4g7ceacg79c1fg86g60eg8ume19@4ax.com>,
> MarkW <markwco@RemoveNoSpamcomcast.net> wrote:
>
> > I was earlier looking at a MacBook Pro for my son. ... He lives in
> > a dorm and we're worried about theft. A laptop is just so easy to
> > steal and with a desktop it can be more easily secured.
>
> You could consider the MacBook (not the MacBook Pro), as this has many
> (most?) of the capabilities of the higher priced MacBook Pro. Personally
> I anticipate the MacBook Pro being upgraded with a new chip well before
> the MacBook, so I would hang back on buying it even it it fitted my
> purposes exactly.
>
> > That's more than we want. It seems that leaves me with the mac mini
> > or the imac.
>
> Back about 18 months I figured optioning a Mac mini closer to an iMac
> brought the prices rather close together. Plus the iMac can take far
> larger hard drives than the Mac mini (although you can use external
> drives with either). Against this, the Mac mini is obviously designed
> for the classroom.
>
> Regarding security and theft, you will notice most Macintosh have a
> security slot, for connection of a security cable. In a dorm situation,
> that would be a first line of defence (if used consistently). Adding one
> of the "call home" software protections would be another. Plus checking
> whether your insurance can cover it.
>
> > I guess one of my questions, if we get a mac mini we'd go with the
> > dual core option which is 1.66 ghz. is this enough power? It seems
> > I'd want closer to 2.0ghz. most of the software will be the Office
> > Suite, Adobe Suite and the Macromedia Suite
>
> Microsoft and Adobe have not as yet converted Office nor the Adobe and
> Macromedia products into a form that runs on the Intel based Macintosh.
> I wouldn't expect them to manage this until at least next year. If you
> run Windows PCs, you probably do not already own copies of the Macintosh
> versions of these products. If you did own them, they would need to run
> under Apple's Rosetta emulation, and the performance would be much
> slower. If these specific products are essential for courses, and going
> to be in heavy use, you probably shouldn't consider a Macintosh until
> the Microsoft and Adobe software have been converted to Universal.

Not sure they run so much slower that it will bother you. That's a
matter of personal impression. Might want to go to an Apple store and
try it out.

>
> > for uses such as email,
> > internet browsing, word processing, some desktop publishing, graphic
> > editing, web page development, and even some editing of digital video
> > so I know I need power. Is 1.66ghz dual core enough?
>
> If using Universal applications (and the Apple ones that come with a
> Macintosh are all Intel capable) the speed will probably be fine. Most
> of the tasks you mention are handled by applications that are included
> with the Macintosh.
>
> Getting more memory would be worthwhile. On the other hand, an external
> hard drive is likely to be cheaper than upgrading the internal one. Plus
> you could use an external for backing up. I wouldn't even think about
> upgrading the internal hard drive myself. The Mac mini isn't intended to
> be opened. Think of it as an appliance. Buy, plug it in, it works, never
> touch it again (except via keyboard).
>
> > want more power. Is it in any way possible to upgrade the CPU in the
> > mac mini? I know this is a lot of upgrades but I've done a lot of work
> > with PC's including building my own. of course this is PC, not Mac
> > but I'm familiar with computer hardware.
>
> There are reports that the Mac mini CPU is in a socket, and there are
> reports of it being upgraded by others. That said, the Mac mini (and the
> iMac) are NOT designed like regular desktop PC. They are not designed to
> be opened. They are not designed to be upgraded. They are totally unlike
> the open plug in architecture of a desktop PC. If you think of both the
> iMac and the Mac mini are being laptops packaged in a different manner
> you are closer to their design philosophy. The only Macintosh designed
> to be opened is the Mac Pro (which is really easy to upgrade).

Actually the iMac is easy to open and components are readily accessible.
However, there are no spare expansion slots or bays. Anyway, upgrade is
probably not a worthwhile consideration for the iMac, other than putting
in more RAM or a bigger HD.

>
> The fact that you have built a PC isn't sufficient experience to deal
> with laptop style construction. Anyone with a screwdriver can learn to
> assemble a desktop PC. If you haven't disassembled and assembled again a
> few laptops, I would forget doing your own upgrades. That said, there
> are lots of sites on the web that provide the instructions, and it isn't
> rocket science, just tedious, painstaking and delicate.
>
> > Also, me and my wife have to travel on business frequently. Has
> > anyone used a mac mini as a portable? It's so small that it seems it
> > could be taken in a small carry bag with a portable sized mouse and
> > keyboard.
>
> Mac mini is fine as a travelling computer, especially if there is a
> monitor available at the other end. The power pack is separate (like a
> giant laptop power pack). However the MacBook laptop is even better as a
> portable. If I were moving between a couple of offices (home and work
> maybe) I'd think a Mac mini would be fine. But for business travel to
> hotels, I'd do it the way other travellers do, and use a laptop. Your
> time is almost surely worth the difference in cost.

--
For email, change <fake> to <earthlink>
Bill Collins

In article <NOSPAmar2005-CCF196.11210924082006@freenews.iinet.net.au>,
Eric Lindsay <NOSPAmar2005@ericlindsay.com> wrote:

> In article <s3qme2l4g7ceacg79c1fg86g60eg8ume19@4ax.com>,
> MarkW <markwco@RemoveNoSpamcomcast.net> wrote:
>
> > I was earlier looking at a MacBook Pro for my son. ... He lives in
> > a dorm and we're worried about theft. A laptop is just so easy to
> > steal and with a desktop it can be more easily secured.
>
> You could consider the MacBook (not the MacBook Pro), as this has many
> (most?) of the capabilities of the higher priced MacBook Pro. Personally
> I anticipate the MacBook Pro being upgraded with a new chip well before
> the MacBook, so I would hang back on buying it even it it fitted my
> purposes exactly.
>
> > That's more than we want. It seems that leaves me with the mac mini
> > or the imac.
>
> Back about 18 months I figured optioning a Mac mini closer to an iMac
> brought the prices rather close together. Plus the iMac can take far
> larger hard drives than the Mac mini (although you can use external
> drives with either). Against this, the Mac mini is obviously designed
> for the classroom.
>
> Regarding security and theft, you will notice most Macintosh have a
> security slot, for connection of a security cable. In a dorm situation,
> that would be a first line of defence (if used consistently). Adding one
> of the "call home" software protections would be another. Plus checking
> whether your insurance can cover it.
>
> > I guess one of my questions, if we get a mac mini we'd go with the
> > dual core option which is 1.66 ghz. is this enough power? It seems
> > I'd want closer to 2.0ghz. most of the software will be the Office
> > Suite, Adobe Suite and the Macromedia Suite
>
> Microsoft and Adobe have not as yet converted Office nor the Adobe and
> Macromedia products into a form that runs on the Intel based Macintosh.
> I wouldn't expect them to manage this until at least next year. If you
> run Windows PCs, you probably do not already own copies of the Macintosh
> versions of these products. If you did own them, they would need to run
> under Apple's Rosetta emulation, and the performance would be much
> slower. If these specific products are essential for courses, and going
> to be in heavy use, you probably shouldn't consider a Macintosh until
> the Microsoft and Adobe software have been converted to Universal.

Not sure they run so much slower that it will bother you. That's a
matter of personal impression. Might want to go to an Apple store and
try it out.

>
> > for uses such as email,
> > internet browsing, word processing, some desktop publishing, graphic
> > editing, web page development, and even some editing of digital video
> > so I know I need power. Is 1.66ghz dual core enough?
>
> If using Universal applications (and the Apple ones that come with a
> Macintosh are all Intel capable) the speed will probably be fine. Most
> of the tasks you mention are handled by applications that are included
> with the Macintosh.
>
> Getting more memory would be worthwhile. On the other hand, an external
> hard drive is likely to be cheaper than upgrading the internal one. Plus
> you could use an external for backing up. I wouldn't even think about
> upgrading the internal hard drive myself. The Mac mini isn't intended to
> be opened. Think of it as an appliance. Buy, plug it in, it works, never
> touch it again (except via keyboard).
>
> > want more power. Is it in any way possible to upgrade the CPU in the
> > mac mini? I know this is a lot of upgrades but I've done a lot of work
> > with PC's including building my own. of course this is PC, not Mac
> > but I'm familiar with computer hardware.
>
> There are reports that the Mac mini CPU is in a socket, and there are
> reports of it being upgraded by others. That said, the Mac mini (and the
> iMac) are NOT designed like regular desktop PC. They are not designed to
> be opened. They are not designed to be upgraded. They are totally unlike
> the open plug in architecture of a desktop PC. If you think of both the
> iMac and the Mac mini are being laptops packaged in a different manner
> you are closer to their design philosophy. The only Macintosh designed
> to be opened is the Mac Pro (which is really easy to upgrade).

Actually the iMac is easy to open and components are readily accessible.
However, there are no spare expansion slots or bays. Anyway, upgrade is
probably not a worthwhile consideration for the iMac, other than putting
in more RAM or a bigger HD.

>
> The fact that you have built a PC isn't sufficient experience to deal
> with laptop style construction. Anyone with a screwdriver can learn to
> assemble a desktop PC. If you haven't disassembled and assembled again a
> few laptops, I would forget doing your own upgrades. That said, there
> are lots of sites on the web that provide the instructions, and it isn't
> rocket science, just tedious, painstaking and delicate.
>
> > Also, me and my wife have to travel on business frequently. Has
> > anyone used a mac mini as a portable? It's so small that it seems it
> > could be taken in a small carry bag with a portable sized mouse and
> > keyboard.
>
> Mac mini is fine as a travelling computer, especially if there is a
> monitor available at the other end. The power pack is separate (like a
> giant laptop power pack). However the MacBook laptop is even better as a
> portable. If I were moving between a couple of offices (home and work
> maybe) I'd think a Mac mini would be fine. But for business travel to
> hotels, I'd do it the way other travellers do, and use a laptop. Your
> time is almost surely worth the difference in cost.

--
For email, change <fake> to <earthlink>
Bill Collins